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I'm sick after Martinsville!

jumpinjoe

jumpinjoe

Hellcat
I watched last Sunday's race at Martinsville with a lot of anticipation. Being the last round of qualifiers before the season ending championship race at Phoenix, and at the 'hands down' best short track in Nascar, I just really expected it to be a good one. Actually the race itself was pretty doggone good, and even though I'm not a big fan of the current 'play-off' system to crown a champion, and I'm even less a big fan of Chase Elliot, the race itself lived up to the hype.

But what I'm sick about is the radio communications between Erik Jones' car and his crew chief and especially his spotter Rick Carelli. Chris Gayle (Jones' crew chief) told Jones to "understand" that Denny Hamlin would be racing him (Jones) hard because there was only 3 points between him (Hamlin) and not making the final race next week at Phoenix meaning that he (Jones) was not to pass Hamlin in order to protect his (Hamlin) qualifying for the championship race. Then his spotter Rick Corelli came on and blatantly said to Jones.... “Don’t pass him, Jones. Stay with him and drive what you can.” In other words, no beating around the bush, you won't be a part of this JGR 4 car team next year, but for now we expect you to follow these team orders and stay behind our one chance to have a car in the finals and protect his rear end.

Now some of you know I have some background in stock car racing from many years ago, long before there were 4 car teams, and when every competitor on the track was a true competitor. About the only driver to driver 'fixes' there were was if a driver was leading way out front in points for the season short track championship and a friend of his was lagging way back in points, then the one lagging might lay back in the final race and do some blocking for his friend running for the championship. Even that leaves something to be desired in the hearts and minds of real, hard core competitors, but we all recognize that 'blocking' is an accepted form of competition. Most of us subscribe to the principle of 'if you're faster than me and fast enough to pass me, then pass me, but I will not just pull over and let you by'. In those days every car/driver on the track was trying to get the best finishing position he was capable of getting. I owned most of my own cars back then so I had nobody giving me any kind of orders regarding my racing. Even if there had been teams and team orders back then I would have either ignored them, or I wouldn't have been racing.

And know too, I've always had a high regard for Coach/Team owner Joe Gibbs. But to think he had a hand in this kind of crap makes me sick. Yeh, it was one of his team cars/drivers (Denny Hamlin #11 Toyota) who needed to be protected of that one point/position, and it was another of his car/drivers (Erik Jones #20 Toyota) who was told to 'not pass, to but protect the other guy'.

I know that today there is far, far more money involved in round-d-round racing than back 50 years ago, but competition is still competition and racing is just form of competition with supposedly competitors. In my book, any driver who would take team orders from anyone....... his car owner, his crew chief, his spotter or anyone else has no business out there in a ride that some true competitor would give a left arm for. And any team owner who would blatantly give out team orders like this has no right to be in the position he is in. And if any car company, whether Toyota, Ford or Chevy pulls strings to impact and/or influence a race with the kind of status that a "NASCAR" sanctioned race should command, they should be thrown out on their asses. Punishment and embarrassment much like Michael Waltrip received several years ago at Richmond IIRC.

Yeh, I'm, sick over what was so blatant in last Sunday's race, I'm even more sick in knowing that at least one of the final four participating in next Sunday's championship race doesn't deserve to be there. Chase Elliot drove to a win last Sunday which qualified him, and Joey Logano drove to a win a couple weeks ago for his spot. Brad Kesolowski qualified on stage points and wins over the whole season. So that leaves Hamlin. If there are any Hamlin fans here, I'm sorry. But the facts are the facts. Someone else should be there going for it ........ someone who maybe finished at Martinsville just one point down due to Hamlin's being protected!!!!!
 
jumpinjoe said:
I watched last Sunday's race at Martinsville with a lot of anticipation. Being the last round of qualifiers before the season ending championship race at Phoenix, and at the 'hands down' best short track in Nascar, I just really expected it to be a good one. Actually the race itself was pretty doggone good, and even though I'm not a big fan of the current 'play-off' system to crown a champion, and I'm even less a big fan of Chase Elliot, the race itself lived up to the hype.

But what I'm sick about is the radio communications between Erik Jones' car and his crew chief and especially his spotter Rick Carelli. Chris Gayle (Jones' crew chief) told Jones to "understand" that Denny Hamlin would be racing him (Jones) hard because there was only 3 points between him (Hamlin) and not making the final race next week at Phoenix meaning that he (Jones) was not to pass Hamlin in order to protect his (Hamlin) qualifying for the championship race. Then his spotter Rick Corelli came on and blatantly said to Jones.... “Don’t pass him, Jones. Stay with him and drive what you can.” In other words, no beating around the bush, you won't be a part of this JGR 4 car team next year, but for now we expect you to follow these team orders and stay behind our one chance to have a car in the finals and protect his rear end.

Now some of you know I have some background in stock car racing from many years ago, long before there were 4 car teams, and when every competitor on the track was a true competitor. About the only driver to driver 'fixes' there were was if a driver was leading way out front in points for the season short track championship and a friend of his was lagging way back in points, then the one lagging might lay back in the final race and do some blocking for his friend running for the championship. Even that leaves something to be desired in the hearts and minds of real, hard core competitors, but we all recognize that 'blocking' is an accepted form of competition. Most of us subscribe to the principle of 'if you're faster than me and fast enough to pass me, then pass me, but I will not just pull over and let you by'. In those days every car/driver on the track was trying to get the best finishing position he was capable of getting. I owned most of my own cars back then so I had nobody giving me any kind of orders regarding my racing. Even if there had been teams and team orders back then I would have either ignored them, or I wouldn't have been racing.

And know too, I've always had a high regard for Coach/Team owner Joe Gibbs. But to think he had a hand in this kind of crap makes me sick. Yeh, it was one of his team cars/drivers (Denny Hamlin #11 Toyota) who needed to be protected of that one point/position, and it was another of his car/drivers (Erik Jones #20 Toyota) who was told to 'not pass, to but protect the other guy'.

I know that today there is far, far more money involved in round-d-round racing than back 50 years ago, but competition is still competition and racing is just form of competition with supposedly competitors. In my book, any driver who would take team orders from anyone....... his car owner, his crew chief, his spotter or anyone else has no business out there in a ride that some true competitor would give a left arm for. And any team owner who would blatantly give out team orders like this has no right to be in the position he is in. And if any car company, whether Toyota, Ford or Chevy pulls strings to impact and/or influence a race with the kind of status that a "NASCAR" sanctioned race should command, they should be thrown out on their asses. Punishment and embarrassment much like Michael Waltrip received several years ago at Richmond IIRC.

Yeh, I'm, sick over what was so blatant in last Sunday's race, I'm even more sick in knowing that at least one of the final four participating in next Sunday's championship race doesn't deserve to be there. Chase Elliot drove to a win last Sunday which qualified him, and Joey Logano drove to a win a couple weeks ago for his spot. Brad Kesolowski qualified on stage points and wins over the whole season. So that leaves Hamlin. If there are any Hamlin fans here, I'm sorry. But the facts are the facts. Someone else should be there going for it ........ someone who maybe finished at Martinsville just one point down due to Hamlin's being protected!!!!!
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Agree completely, I never did like the “team thing”, I pretty much gave up on nascar when they turned there back on the 2nd amendment, and after they went political after the Wallace crap, plus not a Logano or Hamlin fan either. NASCAR is not what it used to be like in days gone by, it’s all now for advertising and making political statements now. Good post Joe.
 
Annihilator said:
Agree completely, I never did like the “team thing”, I pretty much gave up on nascar when they turned there back on the 2nd amendment, and after they went political after the Wallace crap, plus not a Logano or Hamlin fan either. NASCAR is not what it used to be like in days gone by, it’s all now for advertising and making political statements now. Good post Joe.
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Well said completely agree.
I used to watch every race I could on TV. I have not watched in 3yrs. The Wallace thing just made me sick that they twisted to meet a narrative of BLM and Racisms.
The rope had been there a long time at least a year before Wallace showed up
 
The "politics" thing started a couple years ago when NASCAR first "asked" that Confederate flags not be flown and/or displayed anywhere associated with NASCAR, and especially in the track infield. Well, I can understand them asking, considering the 'political' and 'culture' of the day, but them asking is just that..... asking! The fans could make up their own minds and if need be they would/could be 'trespassed'. In probably no more than a couple years the flag would have been just a fond memory to most.

But then, at just the 'right' time, came along the "noose" on the garage door claim by Bubba Wallace and his mechanic that was later proven to have been a door pull from several years earlier. But Bubba went full bore on it and rode the 'politic' train, even making a much bigger deal of the flag issue. Along with him were most of the drivers/pit crews/owners and even the honchos at NASCAR. My guess is that NASCAR highly influenced that spectacle.

I understand NASCAR trying to find a way to accommodate all their fans, but I think they lost sight of who "brung 'em to the dance' .... so to speak. In their shortsightedness and eagerness to make a showing, they over-reacted and harmed their reputation with their earliest fans and supporters. With the proper planning, all fans of all sizes, colors, and any other ethnic groups could have been accommodated equally and in a short time most would have been OK with it.

In all honesty, I don't think NASCAR intentionally turned against their earliest fan base, they just over-reacted to the political atmosphere of the time far too quickly. Without a 'Bubba Wallace' it would/could have been a much smoother transition and accommodation. I can overlook that for the most part, but this crap we witnessed last Sunday is a whole other story.

There are simple and effective ways to put an end to all the team orders and even the big expenditures of these big dollar teams if they really wanted to get back to their roots. But to do it would require them to forego the big dollar investments of the big money sponsors and advertisers. It's a little more difficult to end the big $$$, multi car teams, but even that could be brought to an end, at least for the most part.

I don't know if NASCAR as a sanctioning body could survive those kind of changes today, they're far too deep in the commercialism of the racing industry. What I do know is if someone/some group were to start up a new series of 'stock car' racing around the country keeping the costs reasonable, using stock appearing bodies, and put real and practical rules into effect, I'd never go to another NASCAR event anywhere, and instead go to every 'new' series event I could. Right now as we post here, Tony Stewart and Ray Evernham, and a few others are trying to build a 'start-up' series just like that. I wish them the best and hope to see it in my lifetime.

And as an aside ............ it's only my personal opinion from my very limited association with and knowledge of both Bill France Sr. and Jr, but my guess is NASCAR would not be in the sad shape it's in today if either of the two were still running NASCAR. I don't think there was ever a more 'hardcore' race car competitor than Sr, who started it all back in the late 40's, and even though I never knew him personally, my dad has often talked about how hard and serious a competitor Bill Sr was. Of course it wasn't too long after the forming of NASCAR that Bill Sr ended his driving career for the most part and became the head and vision of NASCAR. Bill Jr, being the seed that didn't fall far from the tree took over from Sr and led NASCAR well for many years.

When Jr. left it in the hands of his son Brain, it all went to hell. He (Brian) didn't care anymore for the racing and competition aspect of it than nothing ......... he just drained it of money and personal influence. My thinking is his daddy and grand daddy are both rolling over in their graves seeing what he has done to NASCAR.
 
jumpinjoe said:
The "politics" thing started a couple years ago when NASCAR first "asked" that Confederate flags not be flown and/or displayed anywhere associated with NASCAR, and especially in the track infield. Well, I can understand them asking, considering the 'political' and 'culture' of the day, but them asking is just that..... asking! The fans could make up their own minds and if need be they would/could be 'trespassed'. In probably no more than a couple years the flag would have been just a fond memory to most.

But then, at just the 'right' time, came along the "noose" on the garage door claim by Bubba Wallace and his mechanic that was later proven to have been a door pull from several years earlier. But Bubba went full bore on it and rode the 'politic' train, even making a much bigger deal of the flag issue. Along with him were most of the drivers/pit crews/owners and even the honchos at NASCAR. My guess is that NASCAR highly influenced that spectacle.

I understand NASCAR trying to find a way to accommodate all their fans, but I think they lost sight of who "brung 'em to the dance' .... so to speak. In their shortsightedness and eagerness to make a showing, they over-reacted and harmed their reputation with their earliest fans and supporters. With the proper planning, all fans of all sizes, colors, and any other ethnic groups could have been accommodated equally and in a short time most would have been OK with it.

In all honesty, I don't think NASCAR intentionally turned against their earliest fan base, they just over-reacted to the political atmosphere of the time far too quickly. Without a 'Bubba Wallace' it would/could have been a much smoother transition and accommodation. I can overlook that for the most part, but this crap we witnessed last Sunday is a whole other story.

There are simple and effective ways to put an end to all the team orders and even the big expenditures of these big dollar teams if they really wanted to get back to their roots. But to do it would require them to forego the big dollar investments of the big money sponsors and advertisers. It's a little more difficult to end the big $$$, multi car teams, but even that could be brought to an end, at least for the most part.

I don't know if NASCAR as a sanctioning body could survive those kind of changes today, they're far too deep in the commercialism of the racing industry. What I do know is if someone/some group were to start up a new series of 'stock car' racing around the country keeping the costs reasonable, using stock appearing bodies, and put real and practical rules into effect, I'd never go to another NASCAR event anywhere, and instead go to every 'new' series event I could. Right now as we post here, Tony Stewart and Ray Evernham, and a few others are trying to build a 'start-up' series just like that. I wish them the best and hope to see it in my lifetime.

And as an aside ............ it's only my personal opinion from my very limited association with and knowledge of both Bill France Sr. and Jr, but my guess is NASCAR would not be in the sad shape it's in today if either of the two were still running NASCAR. I don't think there was ever a more 'hardcore' race car competitor than Sr, who started it all back in the late 40's, and even though I never knew him personally, my dad has often talked about how hard and serious a competitor Bill Sr was. Of course it wasn't too long after the forming of NASCAR that Bill Sr ended his driving career for the most part and became the head and vision of NASCAR. Bill Jr, being the seed that didn't fall far from the tree took over from Sr and led NASCAR well for many years.

When Jr. left it in the hands of his son Brain, it all went to hell. He (Brian) didn't care anymore for the racing and competition aspect of it than nothing ......... he just drained it of money and personal influence. My thinking is his daddy and grand daddy are both rolling over in their graves seeing what he has done to NASCAR.
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Again Joe, I agree. I don’t support anything related to nascar, I usually don’t watch it, but there was nothing else on tv and I don’t watch NFL either since they went full bore political wise. I have been viewing NHRA drag racing, I have been envolved with my local racing here where I live when my brother was drag racing here a few years back. But after some time he gave it up, to expensive.
 
Well, as it stands right now those restrictor plates are only used on two of the many tracks, so as bad as I hate them I can live with them. This is simply a knee jerk reaction by NASCAR to slow the cars down on these two tracks. The technology available to engine builders came along much faster than the 'rule writers' at NASCAR could compensate for.

One of the things I hate even worse than the plates is the advent of electronic fuel injection on the engines and the use of digital dashes and sensors in various places over the cars. Now supposedly none of those sensors are available to the car's chief, engineers, engine builders, etc during the actual running of the race, but who knows. At the very least the driver can see them and radio the readings back to the pits. And now they're talking about going to overhead cams and a wheel center 'knock-off' lug. Oh yeh, I absolutely hate them going with and advertising the alcohol contaminated gasoline. Alcohol should be made for drinking and other medicinal purposes, not for running/ruining our vehicles.

I've often said they can build any 'race specific' engine, drive train, and rear end they want. Especially those designs based on safety. But then that should all be covered with 'show room' stock sheet metal and any part that doesn't fit a 'show room' stock body template is disqualified. Then they need to stand the windshields back up to the angle and height they should be according to the templates. Throw away all the splitters, air dams, and slip streamers, and every other damn piece of aero pieces on the car including the right side window. I'd prefer they went back to stock settings of caster, camber, toe etc, but allowing them to use any safety based piece of suspension and steering they want as long as they fit in the stock locations.

All this could/would save the owners/drivers many thousands of dollars in the building and maintaining these cars. And I'd much rather see 34-40 cars all racing at near the same speeds, even at say 150-160mph, than to see a group of 10-12 way out front running at 200mph+, followed by a second group of 8-10-12 running a 1/4 lap behind at 190-200mph, then a whole bunch later a group running at maybe 180 with all the rest of the 'also rans' trying to keep from being lapped, lap after lap. And these groups are the same groups of cars/drivers week after week after week.

We all know these cars are not anywhere near equal. When one team can spend 1/2+ million dollars on their cars with hours of wind tunnel testing time and others spend maybe $100K on their cars and very limited testing time, there's no way they can be. At almost any current NASCAR race today I can just about tell you the finish running order just by knowing the cars/teams and how deep their pockets are. It doesn't take much to level the playing field if only NASCAR could stand it financially.
 
Good thing there's only one more weekend! And even though I understand what you're saying, some of us with a long time vested interest still care. We have to, it's in our blood. :)(y)(y)(y)

The Cup championship is Sunday at Phoenix. 3:pm on NBC!

Xfinity is Saturday at 5:pm on NBC Sports.

Trucks Friday night at 8:pm on FS1.
 
I like my Nascar
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If I were Jones, I'd have had radio failure! NASCAR is ruining a once great series one rule at a time! Watching the innovations of the manufacturers and teams made the sport what it was. The cars we drove benefited from it. Sadly, those days are gone. I hope Tony Stewart's new series takes them out.
 
Lock n' Load said:
If I were Jones, I'd have had radio failure! NASCAR is ruining a once great series one rule at a time! Watching the innovations of the manufacturers and teams made the sport what it was. The cars we drove benefited from it. Sadly, those days are gone. I hope Tony Stewart's new series takes them out.
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The only trouble with this way of thinking is that it leads to a reputation for Jones that he's not a 'team player'. And unfortunately today, team players are what is required to get a lucrative contract with one of the bigger, better, high dollar teams. We have to remember that some of these driver's contracts are for multi-millions of dollars per year just for driving, then more millions for endorsements, personal products sales, paid engagements, etc, etc. Today it's imperative that a driver brings with him a good money sponsor, or having a big money sponsor willing to pick him up, and not many sponsors will touch a driver with a weak, 'non-team player' reputation.

I know it's easy to say we/I would have ignored the team orders, but if this is our sole means of income, and if we/I have a family to support and maybe aspirations of one day being my own team owner, then it's not so easy to ignore those orders. In today's commercial marketing and political atmosphere, even if against our personal principals, it's not hard to see and understand how/why some drivers will/do bend to the pressure.

It was so much easier to be an individualist and be independent back when most drivers owned their own cars, or even when with a one off sponsor, especially a small town tire store or a local dealership, etc, etc. Back then on occasion even some of the bigger sponsors like "Tide", "Mountain Dew", "Marlboro", etc, would sponsor an individual driver based strictly on the driver's personality and popularity. Not so much anymore ..... in fact those days are gone!

Jones did what he felt he had to do to protect his upcoming contract with "Richard Petty" Motor Sports for next year, and possibly a few years out. There's not much question he'd much prefer a better quality team with top rate equipment, but the way things went this year with Kyle Larson being suspended from NASCAR then being reinstated just in time for "Hendricks" need to fill a seat (shelving the #88 for the #5 instead), Christopher Bell (a Toyota development driver) being in the wings waiting to move into a top quality ride at "JGR", and a few other things not falling just right, he took what was available. I can't say for sure, but all that and his future in NASCAR was probably more on his mind at that moment than anything else.

For all practical purposes the season in reallity (and his association with "JGR") was over for him and he had little chance of bettering his finish position any more than the one spot he's pick up by passing Hamlin, so in his mind I'm sure he felt his decision to follow team orders justified. I don't like it, I'd like to say I wouldn't have done it ........... but I understand it! And in Jones' behalf, his final radio comm with his pit was something similar to this: "Great car today Chris, that's about all I'll say. But I'll be talking to you when we get back in." Chris, his crew chief knew Jones was pissed and answered simply with: "Yep, I understand." Both those comments are paraphrased, but pretty close to what was actually said. They're close enough to make the point that Jones was not happy about the spot he had been put in.
 
jumpinjoe said:
The only trouble with this way of thinking is that it leads to a reputation for Jones that he's not a 'team player'. And unfortunately today, team players are what is required to get a lucrative contract with one of the bigger, better, high dollar teams. We have to remember that some of these driver's contracts are for multi-millions of dollars per year just for driving, then more millions for endorsements, personal products sales, paid engagements, etc, etc. Today it's imperative that a driver brings with him a good money sponsor, or having a big money sponsor willing to pick him up, and not many sponsors will touch a driver with a weak, 'non-team player' reputation.

I know it's easy to say we/I would have ignored the team orders, but if this is our sole means of income, and if we/I have a family to support and maybe aspirations of one day being my own team owner, then it's not so easy to ignore those orders. In today's commercial marketing and political atmosphere, even if against our personal principals, it's not hard to see and understand how/why some drivers will/do bend to the pressure.

It was so much easier to be an individualist and be independent back when most drivers owned their own cars, or even when with a one off sponsor, especially a small town tire store or a local dealership, etc, etc. Back then on occasion even some of the bigger sponsors like "Tide", "Mountain Dew", "Marlboro", etc, would sponsor an individual driver based strictly on the driver's personality and popularity. Not so much anymore ..... in fact those days are gone!

Jones did what he felt he had to do to protect his upcoming contract with "Richard Petty" Motor Sports for next year, and possibly a few years out. There's not much question he'd much prefer a better quality team with top rate equipment, but the way things went this year with Kyle Larson being suspended from NASCAR then being reinstated just in time for "Hendricks" need to fill a seat (shelving the #88 for the #5 instead), Christopher Bell (a Toyota development driver) being in the wings waiting to move into a top quality ride at "JGR", and a few other things not falling just right, he took what was available. I can't say for sure, but all that and his future in NASCAR was probably more on his mind at that moment than anything else.

For all practical purposes the season in reallity (and his association with "JGR") was over for him and he had little chance of bettering his finish position any more than the one spot he's pick up by passing Hamlin, so in his mind I'm sure he felt his decision to follow team orders justified. I don't like it, I'd like to say I wouldn't have done it ........... but I understand it! And in Jones' behalf, his final radio comm with his pit was something similar to this: "Great car today Chris, that's about all I'll say. But I'll be talking to you when we get back in." Chris, his crew chief knew Jones was pissed and answered simply with: "Yep, I understand." Both those comments are paraphrased, but pretty close to what was actually said. They're close enough to make the point that Jones was not happy about the spot he had been put in.
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While I understand the pressure Jones was under, I dislike the fact that he was told to basically "stop racing". This is just one of many reasons I don't really follow NASCAR much anymore except for the trucks, which I think is their best series. I am involved in sprint car racing where there are no radios and the drivers race as hard as they can, from the green flag to the checkered, no matter what their position in the running order is. It just makes for better racing for the fans in my opinion.
 
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Sprints are about the last hold-out to the real roots of circle track racing. They are typically the 'hardest core' of the 'hard core' racing these days. I've had a little involvement in sprints way back when, mostly on the dirt. I still love 'em and still go catch a good dirt race every now and then when I can. (y)(y)(y)

I guess you and I are part of the last remaining few 'die hards'. And like you, I'd much prefer to see no car to pit radio communications. But then we also have to recognize that at the speeds the CUP cars are running, and the required safety aspects of today's tracks, it's pretty hard to use the old sign boards very effectively. :unsure::unsure:
 
jumpinjoe said:
Sprints are about the last hold-out to the real roots of circle track racing. They are typically the 'hardest core' of the 'hard core' racing these days. I've had a little involvement in sprints way back when, mostly on the dirt. I still love 'em and still go catch a good dirt race every now and then when I can. (y)(y)(y)

I guess you and I are part of the last remaining few 'die hards'. And like you, I'd much prefer to see no car to pit radio communications. But then we also have to recognize that at the speeds the CUP cars are running, and the required safety aspects of today's tracks, it's pretty hard to use the old sign boards very effectively. :unsure::unsure:
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In most if not all sprint car series these days, one way radio from race control to the drivers is required. From a safety standpoint, it's a good thing as it allows the tower to alert the drivers of an incident immediately. On starts, cautions, and reds, it also allows drivers to focus on what's around them rather than the starter or the track warning lights although the corner flagmen are also extremely important. If you have a scanner, the frequencies are between 453-454 mhz. with 454.000 mhz. being the most widely used for better signal penetration.
 
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Well, today was a pretty good race, and at all tracks ..... Phoenix! I've never really liked that track and don't even really know why. I kinda' always liked watching the 'Silver Crown' series there and the sprints for the most part, although my favorite for sprints is and always will be on the dirt. But after today, I like it (Phoenix) a little better.

Chase Elliot won the championship (Nascar Series Cup title) beating out Joey Logano after the last caution. Joey got out of the pits first but Chase caught him after a few laps and held the lead to the finish. He's (Chase) just 24 years old so he has a lot of years ahead of him to win a few more. And he's part of a family that is only one of three who both father and son have won that title. Obviously his dad Bill Elliot and him, then Ned and Dale Jarrett, and of course the Petty's, Lee and Richard. Logano ran second in the championship, Brad Keslowski was 3rd and Dennie Hamlin again was 4th. Brad was good, just not quite good enough and Dennie was .... well, just Dennie again. He just didn't seem to have what he needed again. Hard to say whether it was the car or himself.

His crew was pretty much spot on all day getting him in and out of the pits, but he just couldn't seem to quite be where he needed to be in speed and drive ability. This was his 4th time in the final 4 IIRC...... some are saying he just might be the best driver to ever not win a championship. Much like Mark Martin from days long gone by.

And Jimmie Johnson, 7 times champion retired formally today from fulltime Nascar racing. He does expect to come back and run a race every now and then in both Cup and Xfinity, but his real passion now is to run a series of Indy car road courses for a couple years. He made the off hand comment that he's looking forward to driving something with "WAY too much horse power". LOL! There's never been anything with "Way too much horse power" as far as I know.... although I have seen a few times when there was "Way too little driver"!

Anyway for all you NASCAR fans, that's about how it all went down today. Nothing really any more spectacular, and most everything pretty much status quo. Oh, before I forget it .... in response to the previous post by Lock n' Load, I agree with the radio comms between race control and drivers simply for the sake of safety. And as for the sprints, I'd really like to see them go to starters and transmissions so that every wreck doesn't cause so much dead time. Other than that I'm perfectly OK with the sprint's series, especially WOO's and ASCS, and even the midgets. (Can I say that here?) ;) :(
 
Was a good race today, glad Logano didn’t win, can’t stand him or Hamlin much either. Chase ran a good race, actually all ran good, nothing dirty today. I’m an old Dale Sr fan, game has changed a lot since he was with us. Not into the other racing that’s mentioned here, like the NHRA that’s about it.
 
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