Kimber and Springfield 1911s…

[Philmo11]

I’ve really enjoyed following this thread and have learned a lot, the Kimber Rapide looks great however I’m not big on slide cut outs. To @Philmo11 and @Annihilator and anyone else what are your thoughts on the differences between 1911’s with a barrel bushing and those without such as my Emissary?
Which one is more accurate if there is a difference and which one is subject to eventual wear over the other?

My opinion, if you get a good fit with the bushing and barrel fit, very accurate, but a bull barrel like that’s on your Emissary is a very tight fit and should be very accurate for a longer period of time due to no wear between the older barrel/bushing setup. Many years ago I installed a bull barrel on my Colt 1911, personally, I prefer the bull barrel, but that’s me, my Kimber Pro Carry II has the bull barrel setup.

I think most are inclined to agree with @Annihilator as he makes a good point. One advantage, at least for competitive shooters is the bull barrel adds weight which helps steady and mitigate recoil. It does take one part out of the equation for fitment, however, it’s pretty negligible in my opinion. It’s going to wear bushing or no bushing.

I prefer the bushings myself. A good smith can properly fit the bushing. One thing Springfield is good at is fitment. Most of those i tested above are pretty tight. I really have to work at getting a couple of those bushings out to clean the gun, two I had to use the barrel to pull the bushing free.

One of the main reason I prefer the bushing is that if I ever need to change the barrel, there is nothing to do on the slide. Any barrel bushing combo that has been properly fit can be dropped in and fit to length and lug.

 

[Philmo11]

Another thing to note is that the bushing/bull barrel is only part of the equation. If you have slide play in the fitment or the chamber end of the barrel isn’t properly fitted to the slide, you won’t see any advantage of one over the other as any perceived gain will be lost to the play in other areas.

 

[Philmo11]

Back to the Rapide. 5 shot group. Again in low light, it was dusk. Like the others, take consideration it shoots better than the shooter. 13/16” is what I measured.

 

[Philmo11]

@Keystone19250 notice it has a bushing

 

[Philmo11]

Stainless Springfield Garrison in 45 ordered.

 

[Philmo11]

Since this thread started, my 1911 collection has grown a bit as you might imagine. I set out in Jan to rebuild after selling off a bunch.

This is what I had left when the first Kimber showed up

3/10

3/24

3/25

5/6

5/24

Unfortunately I don’t have them all here to get the new pic with the Rapide. The first Garrison 9 is at Springfield, Garrison 45 is in transit, and Kimber 10 is at Kimber and another Garrison 9 is in transit. Went from 5 in March to 13 in May and that doesn’t include the backordered Colt.

 

[Pitdogg2]

Well, when the Kimber 10mm returns, I found plenty of ammo. Picked up 20 boxes of S&B 180gr FMJ.
View attachment 27633

I've put a few thousand rounds of that through my 3.8" compact OSP. Cost locally is $27 per box.

Whats your opinion on Les Baer's 1911's?

Damn fine guns but there's a cost to play with Les. If you can afford the cost jump in with both feet!

 

[Keystone19250]

@Keystone19250 notice it has a bushing

Thank you for the video as like I said in my post I enjoy learning and getting other people’s perspective.
That being said @Annihilator answered my question but your video did not, so a gun custom made costing
$2,500-$3,000 has a bushing instead of a Bull barrel like my Emissary which is $1,350 does the bushing make it better?
You said you prefer a 1911 with a bushing
Then that’s what you like and of course I respect that I’m very happy with my Emissary that has the bull barrel and although I don’t have a video showing me shoot steel plates my recent trip to the range shows my gun is very accurate.

 

[Philmo11]

Thank you for the video as like I said in my post I enjoy learning and getting other people’s perspective.
That being said @Annihilator answered my question but your video did not, so a gun custom made costing
$2,500-$3,000 has a bushing instead of a Bull barrel like my Emissary which is $1,350 does the bushing make it better?
You said you prefer a 1911 with a bushing
Then that’s what you like and of course I respect that I’m very happy with my Emissary that has the bull barrel and although I don’t have a video showing me shoot steel plates my recent trip to the range shows my gun is very accurate.
View attachment 27751

Video was only to demonstrate that if it’s well built, it really makes no difference. No more than 15%accuracy loss after 20,000 rounds is a pretty significant mark to hit.

Just shooting two groups in a row, the shooter would likely have more influence than 15%.

 

[Philmo11]

I've put a few thousand rounds of that through my 3.8" compact OSP. Cost locally is $27 per box.

I’ve never had a problem with S&B ammo. Scheels had a 10% off handgun ammo so said and done it was right at $499/1000 rds after tax, which is cheap for 10mm.

 

[Philmo11]

Btw, I found those Rapide grips at VZ Grips and ordered two pair. I love those grips. I’ll save the others for another occasion. I really like that look and feel.

Further note, little brother bought his Ruger Commander size 9mm and I brought the Kimber Rapide out to the in-laws this afternoon. We ran 150/each and still running strong, both of them.

He brought his Taurus .357 out too. Those grips I put on it made it a very comfortable shooter. Brother-in-law didn’t care for them. Small guy, 5’8”, small hands. Grip was big for him. I was standing too close to the cylinder blast when reloading earlier, left ear is still ringing. Big difference between 9mm and .357 noise.

 

[Philmo11]

1911 day on the range.

Wife got hold of that Rapide and put 400rds through it. It’s up to 600 now and still kicking. Just barely lobs the brass out the top. Easy finding brass.

We had 3 FTF today, two in the 10mm Kimber Stainless and one in the 45 Kimber Stainless. Both still breaking in. Needed oil I didn’t have with me. Maybe 50rds each today. I had 7 I was shooting while she broke that Rapide the rest of the way in. First gun she said she really liked since I bought her 380 back in 2019.

I’m interested to see how she likes the Garrison 9mm when it returns. I think the slide is a bit lighter on it from what I remember.

 

[Kodiak Cowboy]

Kimber Rapide Dawn in 9mm is here. I was looking forward to sharing the good, the bad and the ugly, but I only have good things to say about this Rapide. The bad and the ugly will have to wait on another gun... I'd be lying through my teeth if I said this thing was ugly. Its beautimous!
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There will be some wear on the barrel right where that dark strip is. Its already worn through the gold color after 3 mags.
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Front strap texture
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Backstrap
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Great sight picture
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First, I was hesitant that this was going to run 9mm without a problem. Its tight and a little on the stout side racking the slide, for a 9mm that is. Still not as heavy as a 10mm or 45 but a little on the stouter side of 9mm. Trigger was beautiful. Very smooth pull and crisp on the break. no sponginess.

I ran 3 magazines through it of hand loads. These were moderate, barely subsonic 115gr round nose (I'm out of factory 9mm). It ran flawless. Mild and accurate enough during rapid fire to stay on target without even using sights. Handling is incredible.
View attachment 27713
I will do an accuracy test tomorrow and check sight alignment. We were planning on a 1911 range day here but it got pushed until tomorrow. If it shoots groups anything like it handles, I'd recommend it without a hesitation. I have reservation about the Kimpro finish holding up but only time will tell that. It appears to be very well done and replicates a satin stainless very well. If I did not know it was Kimpro, I would not have known any better by its appearance.

Look'n good!

 

[Philmo11]

Two updates, the first one…

The two new Springfield Garrisons came in, one in 45 and another in 9mm.

Good news on the 45, it has run without issue. Haven’t accuracy tested it yet but so far so good.

The 9mm, not so good. Pretty consistent if the slide is closed when a full mag is inserted, the first round will not chamber. It’s not the mag because I also tested the ones I’ve been using in the Rapide, including the one from the other Garrison 9mm. It will hang on the feed ramp 100% of the time.

If the slide is open when the full mag is inserted, the round will chamber half of the time. Rounds 2-5 pretty consistently hang. Sometimes a bump on the slide will send it into battery, most of the time it’s a firm hang on the feed ramp.

Rounds 6-9 will usually chamber but not always eject. I did smooth out the engraving on the bottom of the slide on the 9mm but it made no difference. The 45 could use that treatment but it runs as is. So far, the 9mm Garrison is 0 for 2. Still waiting for the first one to return from Springfield.

I will add that these two meet my expectations on finish better than the first. The first one had some slight tapering at the edges where the flats were sanded in the factory. These two (1 came from Alabama, the other from California) have nice crisp edges.

 

[Philmo11]

Second update…

Kimber Stainless II 10mm slide refinish is done. VZ Fallout grips on the 10mm and the 45. Just need my magwells and they will be complete.

I am very happy with how those two Stainless II’s turned out. The VZ Fallout grips are very aggressive, a little too aggressive for my taste but I’ll get used to them. You sure as hell aren’t going to drop one, that’s for dang sure.

 

[PacNWvike]

Man you have putting some time and money in. Guns are looking good. I got another 150 rounds through my dads Kimber tle ii, still no issues. He is ordering some Wilson elite tactical mags.

Sorry to hear about the 9mm issues with the garrison. I almost recommended it to a friend before checking back in on this post. So I will warn him.

 

[Pitdogg2]

I really like the looks of the Kimber 10mm Rapide in black barrel. Boy they are pricey! I hope they work well, I've heard some grumbling about them so who knows.

 

[Talyn]

 

[Philmo11]

View attachment 27945

I’m stealing that one

 

[Philmo11]

I really like the looks of the Kimber 10mm Rapide in black barrel. Boy they are pricey! I hope they work well, I've heard some grumbling about them so who knows.

The Rapide Black Ice in 10mm was my first choice but production is suspended. The Dawn was my second choice.