Biggfoot44
Master Class
When we transitioned from old school Mace to OC , the use of force guidelines also changed , making OC available much lower on the scale .
The Importance and Types of Non-Lethal Items
- Thread starter Talyn
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When we transitioned from old school Mace to OC , the use of force guidelines also changed , making OC available much lower on the scale .
Biggfoot44
Master Class
I haven't had opportunity to deploy or train with Gel . How is the long -er range accuracy, trajectory, and wind resistance, compared to Stream ?
That curiosity aside , I've found Cone to be the sweet spot within typical * interpersonal encounter " distances. Helps for getting full ( target area) coverage with fast draw, weak hand " point spraying " .
That curiosity aside , I've found Cone to be the sweet spot within typical * interpersonal encounter " distances. Helps for getting full ( target area) coverage with fast draw, weak hand " point spraying " .
That’s another reason several of us recommend OC with your firearm as a civilian. All 50 states use of force states when force is used even deadly force it has to be “reasonable”
And a lot of folks invest a lot of $$ and time and ego into firearms platforms (I get it shooting is fun) but they don’t like the truth and that is 99.99% of all your interactions you are probably ok to use OC but your not legal to shoot or use deadly force. And an ASP or knife is deadly force so it’s like using a gun.
If it’s a bad OC use it’s simple misdemeanor battery and you go home with a small fine if it’s with an asp case it can be the difference between simple battery and battery with injury!!!!
That’s not a popular pill for a lot of gun guys to take but how it is.
All makes and models are gonna vary
Since I use POM industry products I can speak there.
The spray stream is around 12 feet max. The MK3 Gel has a range max around 18 feet
I know in the late 80’s early 90’s the agencies that had faluirs it was traced to their solutions. Other agencies had great results. The industry has gotten a lot better as the data on the companies that failed to improve were run out of buisness for the most part. I would stay away from the cheap gas station or gun show mace slray stuff for that reason.
The best ones and 2 of the legitimate companies are POM and Sabre
Here is a link for POM which I really like or I wouldn’t use them in my classes or have family carry
Best Self Defense POM Pepper Spray
Pepper Spray is one of the best self-defense tools for everyone to stay prepared and protected. Pepper Spray Made with oleoresin capsicum (OC).
pompepperspray.com
The Night Rider
Professional
IDK, I mean, the word "threatened." never appeared once in my post.
I was taught to shake my spray up before I used it. I was also taught that that was a visual cue to the person that you were getting ready to spread them and I must admit that every single time I did it the person knew what I was getting ready to do.
Then I was instructed to verbally warn them I was going to spray them before I did.
"Stop whatever you're doing or I will spray you."
If you take issue with that take it up with my trainers
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The Night Rider
Professional
I mean, I'm just giving you my direct personal experience with somebody who has been sprayed with gel. I'm also repeating what I've heard several name trainers say is drawback of gel. I think even a couple of cops on this forum have said the same thing.
The Night Rider
Professional
Please note that Mr Baker also says that Gel takes a little while to take effect
The Night Rider
Professional
As opposed to the military? Or other person who is subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice? Because as I'm sure you know, cops are civilians
Not trying to play lawyer ball. Cops belong to civilian LE agencies I get it. My point or term of civilian is LEOs have been trained (not saying there are not many that are not proficient) and equipped by the state, county or municipalities and have that often misunderstood thing called Qualified Immunity (which doesn’t shield them from illegal acts) a civilian aka Joe citizen isn’t required to respond to emergencies disturbances etc and is has nobody to fall back on!
I’m not arguing with Mr Bakernhe does a phonominal job at his page and channel.
From my experience (and I have used OC on several dozen folks myself and supervised and did the use of force reports in hundreds of others) there is not enough of a difference to make a difference. Like 9mm vs 45 if you don’t get any method of OC delivery on the right let’s it’s going to not be as effective.
Factor in if it’s a real thug that’s been sprayed before he could have the motivation and wil power and just plain experience to fight through it.
Using OC is no different than a handgun in if you give them a blast you asses I and if BG isn’t responding as he should a second spray would not be a bad idea. And adjusting aim if you have to. After that I wouldn’t stick around as a private citizen I’d beat feat as 90% even if he wants to chase you he’s going to be slowed with the effects. Gel. Stream or cone!
Biggfoot44
Master Class
If they didn't need spraying, it was in the belt carrier . When they crossed the line to need spraying, they were sprayed .
PAGunGuy
Custom
We do have one young man who is a black belt in Krav Maga, so that's a huge plus. But he's not there every service.
Yea, I think I will probably pick up a OC spray (gel)