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Candelas, Lumens and Everything Else — All About Tactical Lights

Bassbob said:
You posted this as a sentence. Which I quoted and responded to. SO if you meant to add an 'Except when", you should have.

The sentence you posted as it's own stand alone paragraph is false since it very well could be " The first one to turn on the flashlight wins". And I'm pretty sure that's what I said.
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So you're point went without saying, that's why you didn't say it. But altough I did say it, the next sentence, it doesn't count? Have you ever heard of "taking someone out of context"?

Please I want to know what your instructors say about your belief, "The first one to turn on the flashlight wins"

Are you saying, well its not impossible that you could be very lucky to turn your flashlight on the threat is right in front of you with his back turned and you could get the drop on him, therefore, if you only take the first sentence of the post and ignore the rest, the extremely slight chances it could turn out differently and ignoring the rest of the post, proves it categorically false? Do you want to throw in a blue moon in those conditions, to go along with all the backflips in reasoning?

Might want to consider if you have become emotionally invested in your initial reaction?
Bassbob said:
It's like saying:

Carrying a gun with a manual safety will get you killed.

And then in the next paragraph going on about how that really isn't totally true or totally the whole story.
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:ROFLMAO: Who says that? I would never say that? So I'm supposed to see your point.
 
RickAnderson said:
So you're point went without saying, that's why you didn't say it. But altough I did say it, the next sentence, it doesn't count? Have you ever heard of "taking someone out of context"?

Please I want to know what your instructors say about your belief, "The first one to turn on the flashlight wins"

Are you saying, well its not impossible that you could be very lucky to turn your flashlight on the threat is right in front of you with his back turned and you could get the drop on him, therefore, if you only take the first sentence of the post and ignore the rest, the extremely slight chances it could turn out differently and ignoring the rest of the post, proves it categorically false? Do you want to throw in a blue moon in those conditions, to go along with all the backflips in reasoning?

Might want to consider if you have become emotionally invested in your initial reaction?

:ROFLMAO: Who says that? I would never say that? So I'm supposed to see your point.
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You must not have read what you typed from previous post.

Excerpts
 
So apparently, making a light hearted quip to get a general point across is offensive to some.

The point is;
Revealing you position in combat, either military or self-defense in civilian life, can get you killed...
Many things used to obtain your threats position, will reveal you position, and most likely before you obtained the threats position....

There are all sort of reasons to use lights, laser, tracers, active sensors....
But in combat, you have to be very aware of how your active sensor (and flashlights were active sensors centuries before the term was created) revealing your position while you try to ascertain the other position....

There are all sorts of stories of stand-offs, including snipers, with each side taking hours, days trying to ascertain the others position without revealing their own position, cause both knew, the moment they reveal their position, their threat has the drop on them and its over...
 
RickAnderson said:
So you're point went without saying, that's why you didn't say it. But altough I did say it, the next sentence, it doesn't count? Have you ever heard of "taking someone out of context"?

Please I want to know what your instructors say about you belief, "The first one to turn on the flashlight wins"

Are you saying, well its not impossible that you could be very lucky to turn your flashlight on the threat is right in front of you with his back turned and you could get the drop on him, therefore, if you only take the first sentence of the post and ignore the rest, the extremely slight chances it could turn out differently and ignoring the rest of the post, proves it categorically false? Do you want to throw in a blue moon in those conditions, to go along with all the backflips in reasoning?

Might want to consider if you have become emotionally invested in your initial reaction?

:ROFLMAO: Who says that? I would never say that? So I'm supposed to see your point.
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You just did the same thing. You made a statement. A single snarky sentence. Just sayin.

Then in the next paragraph you explain that there could be exceptions and blah, blah, blah.


Two guys in the dark. One in his own house. He sees a figure in the dark. Shines a blinding light in the intruder's face temporarily blinding him. Shoots him. That is a tactical use of a weapon light, one of the tenets of training with a weapon light and is a direct contradiction to this.


Gun fight in the dark? First guy to turn on his flashlight loses. Just sayin...




It seems like you are preaching about how you apparently know more than all the people who train and advocate for WMLs in HD/SD situations. The fact that you made that sentence and let it stand alone makes that clear. I merely pointed out the intended uses of a WML

And bassbob doesn't get emotionally invested in anything. He doesn't have a soul and you can't kill what's already dead. :)
 
TEXASforLIFE said:
You must not have read what you typed from previous post.

Excerpts
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I lost you? Did you fail to finish the post?

As far as the Manual Safeties get you killed, and then a next paragraph explaining well not really.
Well yea, if the person is making a point because of habit and stress someone might leave a manual safety on, that is why training is so important. I would agree, not declare them categorically false.
 
RickAnderson said:
So apparently, making a light hearted quip to get a general point across is offensive to some.

The point is;
Revealing you position in combat, either military or self-defense in civilian life, can get you killed...
Many things used to obtain your threats position, will reveal you position, and most likely before you obtained the threats position....

There are all sort of reasons to use lights, laser, tracers, active sensors....
But in combat, you have to be very aware of how your active sensor (and flashlights were active sensors centuries before the term was created) revealing your position while you try to ascertain the other position....

There are all sorts of stories of stand-offs, including snipers, with each side taking hours, days trying to ascertain the others position without revealing their own position, cause both knew, the moment they reveal their position, their threat has the drop on them and its over...
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That doesn't have anything at all to do with the article or with WML on SD guns. We are civilians, not snipers. You seem to spend a lot of time here going to lengths about your superior tactical knowledge and training.
 
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RickAnderson said:
I lost you? Did you fail to finish the post?

As far as the Manual Safeties get you killed, and then a next paragraph explaining well not really.
Well yea, if the person is making a point because of habit and stress someone might leave a manual safety on, that is why training is so important. I would agree, not declare them categorically false.
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Maybe categorically was the wrong term. Making that blanket statement like you did was incorrect. That was my only point. And again, I will point out that I am not advocating for WMLs. I don't use them.
 
RickAnderson said:
I lost you? Did you fail to finish the post?

As far as the Manual Safeties get you killed, and then a next paragraph explaining well not really.
Well yea, if the person is making a point because of habit and stress someone might leave a manual safety on, that is why training is so important. I would agree, not declare them categorically false.
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No, I was finished.
 
Bassbob said:
You just did the same thing. You made a statement. A single snarky sentence. Just sayin.

Then in the next paragraph you explain that there could be exceptions and blah, blah, blah.


Two guys in the dark. One in his own house. He sees a figure in the dark. Shines a blinding light in the intruder's face temporarily blinding him. Shoots him. That is a tactical use of a weapon light, one of the tenets of training with a weapon light and is a direct contradiction to this.


Gun fight in the dark? First guy to turn on his flashlight loses. Just sayin...




It seems like you are preaching about how you apparently know more than all the people who train and advocate for WMLs in HD/SD situations. The fact that you made that sentence and let it stand alone makes that clear. I merely pointed out the intended uses of a WML

And bassbob doesn't get emotionally invested in anything. He doesn't have a soul and you can't kill what's already dead. :)
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Show your instructors the post, the whole post, ask them if it is categorically false, and having a following disclaimer paragraph is something that doesn't count....
Bassbob said:
It seems like you are preaching about how you apparently know more than all the people who train and advocate for WMLs in HD/SD situations. The fact that you made that sentence and let it stand alone makes that clear. I merely pointed out the intended uses of a WML

And bassbob doesn't get emotionally invested in anything. He doesn't have a soul and you can't kill what's already dead. :)
Click to expand...
:ROFLMAO: I posted 4 sentences, you are the one dragging this out about how it categorically false, well the rest of the post doesn't count, and now are arguing if you don't count the rest of the post, there are some exceptions that it could turn out different (which makes it conditionally false) is why it categorically false. :ROFLMAO:

I'd like to think I have a soul and can be killed and am not already dead. Perhaps that is why we differ over how wise it being the first one to turn on a flashlight in a gun fight in the dark.
 
RickAnderson said:
Show your instructors the post, the whole post, ask them if it is categorically false, and having a following disclaimer paragraph is something that doesn't count....

:ROFLMAO: I posted 4 sentences, you are the one dragging this out about how it categorically false, well the rest of the post doesn't count, and now are arguing if you don't count the rest of the post, there are some exceptions that it could turn out different (which makes it conditionally false) is why it categorically false. :ROFLMAO:

I'd like to think I have a soul and can be killed and am not already dead. Perhaps that is why we differ over how wise it being the first one to turn on a flashlight in a gun fight in the dark.
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Not dead, dead inside.

Let me recant.

The first guy to turn on a flashlight isn't necessarily going to lose. Especially if he isn't an idiot.
 
So are you seeing I made a quip, that was intended to be funny but have a point?

I said there are reasons for them.
I said think before you turn them on.
I said cops have procedures that may require them to turn them and we should appreciate how they do a dangerous job despite being required to put them at a disadvantage.

In my experience, most idiots don't realize they are an idiot.

Most people spinning their pistol on the finger like a western movie, won't necessarily shoot themselves, Especially if their not an idiot. I'd prefer to say, Someone spins their pistol on their finger like a western movie, they're going to shoot themselves, just sayin....
Apparently I will need to asterisks such quips with full footnotes about probabilities, conditions and situations, for the few that take offense at such things....
 
Getting back to the thread I have a light/laser combo mounted on my Emissary as it is (for now) designated as my nightstand gun, I have the laser function turned off.
The toggle switch is a quick on and off or will lock on, with a quick double tap it goes to strobe which honestly I don’t like.

I do have a hand held light that I’ve had for a couple years and use for night time wildlife rescue work which is scary bright, the only issue it eats batteries like I eat mini snickers bars.
 
As a follow up the hand held is a Rayovac 2000 lumen light with a
3 stage button, high, Low and strobe.
It is so bright the lens is frosted.

Edit…..
The light is referred to as Tactical, wrong…..
I dislike the use of that word just to sell products, the button to change the beam settings is on the end of the handle which; due to the weight of the flashlight is difficult to use one handed so not very useful if your also in the middle of a defensive situation with a handgun.
Overall a great light for spotting.
6E41E61E-C510-448D-96D0-F06B63C7EF7F.jpeg
 
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RickAnderson said:
So are you seeing I made a quip, that was intended to be funny but have a point?

I said there are reasons for them.
I said think before you turn them on.
I said cops have procedures that may require them to turn them and we should appreciate how they do a dangerous job despite being required to put them at a disadvantage.

In my experience, most idiots don't realize they are an idiot.

Most people spinning their pistol on the finger like a western movie, won't necessarily shoot themselves, Especially if their not an idiot. I'd prefer to say, Someone spins their pistol on their finger like a western movie, they're going to shoot themselves, just sayin....
Apparently I will need to asterisks such quips with full footnotes about probabilities, conditions and situations, for the few that take offense at such things....
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Not offense Rick. Dead inside, remember. I was just pointing out that your quip, on it's own, isn't a "Truth". It's a failing of mine I suppose. A pet peeve. I suppose a smiley instead of "Just sayin.." might have disarmed me, but who knows. I mean I also get all filled with :rolleyes: when people point out the obvious in a room full of people who certainly already know so....

I think some of the disconnect might be that some of us have been around here and had all these discussions many, many times before and when someone new comes in and makes comments that we have been over many times it trips something in my brain that disables the part that controls couth and decorum. That being the case, my apologies sir. I will try to remember that not everyone has been here from the beginning and had all these pedestrian conversations with us over and over and I am not the supreme ruler or arbitrator of what gets said around here.
 
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