Defense ammo, low grain and high Ft-lbs energy, is it worth it?

[AABigRick]

Hello all, when searching for self defense ammo, with accuracy being the same should we be looking at the highest amount of ft.-lbs of energy for the round?, or more of fast expansion of the round. I would think that ft-lbs of energy would be a big factor but I see that is generally achieved from lower weight projectiles. Are you we just looking for that magic depth range and expansion in a ballistic target, or is that ft. lbs of energy creating that larger energy transfer into the body something that should be at the top of the list. I have had mixed thoughts on the temporary wound channel created which can make this even more confusing. I have generally relied on Hornady or federal defense rounds because of the amount of data on them being effective, but I dont want to discount hotter faster rounds with more energy, though my thoughts may be seriously flawed. Someone educate me.

For example, in my .357 sig,

I generally had carried Hornady 124 grain, 502 ft/lbs @ 1350 velocity

But looking at the energy power of the Grizzly cartridge 90 grain, 721 foot/lbs @ 1900 feet a second

thats a lot more foot/lbs.

Thoughts

 

[OkiePewPew]

I get where you’re coming from with bears or gators but don’t know enough to have a valid opinion. For human self defense I look at only 2 things, expansion and penetration depth. If it’s quality ammo that opens consistently to a large diameter and hits the magic 16-18 inches, I’m happy.
I’m sure there are others here with a much deeper knowledge of ballistics who can explain why I may be wrong or right.

 

[AABigRick]

I get where you’re coming from with bears or gators but don’t know enough to have a valid opinion. For human self defense I look at only 2 things, expansion and penetration depth. If it’s quality ammo that opens consistently to a large diameter and hits the magic 16-18 inches, I’m happy.
I’m sure there are others here with a much deeper knowledge of ballistics who can explain why I may be wrong or right.

thanks pew pew

 

[HansGruber]

Foot pounds don’t wound.

I’ll say that again—foot pounds don’t wound.

“Hydrostatic shock” isn’t real; what most people call hydrostatic shock is actually temporary cavity damage...and most defensive handgun bullets don’t do enough of it to matter.

Which brings us to permanent wound channel; in short, expansion and penetration...the only things that matter.

So, no, lightweight, warp speed wünderbüllets are not worth the money, or the tome to consider them.

 

[AABigRick]

Foot pounds don’t wound.

I’ll say that again—foot pounds don’t wound.

“Hydrostatic shock” isn’t real; what most people call hydrostatic shock is actually temporary cavity damage...and most defensive handgun bullets don’t do enough of it to matter.

Which brings us to permanent wound channel; in short, expansion and penetration...the only things that matter.

So, no, lightweight, warp speed wünderbüllets are not worth the money, or the tome to consider them.

Alrighty then, thanks

 

[TEXASforLIFE]

It's a combo of cartridge, caliber and distance! It's never a perfect world for all to work? Velocity gets you the distance. Caliber gets you the energy and distance fills in the rest. High velocity at close range can go threw without the expansion on most to all calibers? Know what the maximum expansion velocity is for the caliber and it helps! Not all companies publish this information, but a call to them could get you the answers? I use fmj, so I wouldn't be the best for hp ammo answers?

 

[TEXASforLIFE]

I carry them for those who try too shoot from cover. HP is little use, but fmj will get you! This would be from a pistol round not a rifle. I use junkers for testing! Don't forget the trash can scene from "Police Squad"!

 

[Annihilator]

I never really gave it much thought, I guess I go by how much the bullet expands mostly, but now, you guys got me thinking......

 

[Gottabkiddin]

As long as it will penetrate to the vitals, the rest is gravy. IMO, nothing wrong with slow and heavy. I always choose the heavy for caliber round when I can. The heavy round will usually penetrate deeper and have more bone crushing ability, it also stands a better chance of less deviation over the lighter ones.

 

[southtex]

I get where you’re coming from with bears or gators but don’t know enough to have a valid opinion. For human self defense I look at only 2 things, expansion and penetration depth. If it’s quality ammo that opens consistently to a large diameter and hits the magic 16-18 inches, I’m happy.
I’m sure there are others here with a much deeper knowledge of ballistics who can explain why I may be wrong or right.

Roger that...I look at expansion with passable penetration.

 

[SATRP]

I've always carried heaviest for cartridge self-defense ammo. Penetration is the dominant criterion for effecting incapacitation. I would take expansion if I could get it. But I never rely upon ammo marketers ads displaying perfect expansion. Federal's HST LE line of ammo has established a track record for consistent expansion. But I primarily rely upon penetration.