DEI TEAM

[rcurtner]

That’s a load of bullshit. Go look in the sorting room of any downtown post office. Buncha fat, female diversity hires on they cell phones I know for a fact P&G quota hires and immediately writes off that labor cost as a loss. I was straight up told I would be doing my work as well as “ other people’s work” and if I complained, I would be the one getting fired. I turned the job down. “ Diversity “ hires KNOW they aren’t going to be fired and they act accordingly. I see it every day where I work.

Either you live in a tiny, warped slice of reality or you’re just propagating far left bullshit. You rail on Fox News, which my guess is nobody here even watches, but you sound like a DNC mouthpiece or any legacy media outlet.

You hit the nail on the head, good for you!!

 

[jschmidt]

Yes, I can think of both kinds of businesses, but I'm not sure the word "often" describes any business that would not hire the best person for the job or that they "don't seek non-white customers". Neither of those assertions favor a good business to begin with nor the best opportunity to grow. This seems to imply that certain businesses are deliberately held back and/or harmed in effort to resist diversity. If that's the case, why would there be the business?

I've highlighted the last line in your post because it's the line I'm going to especially refer to. Everything you've said is obviously your perspective, but not necessarily everyone's. I'm not saying it's wrong, only that not everyone in all honesty sees it the same/your way.

To my point about your last line: I'm not sure "Popular" is the right descriptor under most circumstances, and while diversity can be a good thing under most circumstances ... diversity just for sake of diversity ... not so much!

Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

It happens when the owners are racist. Racists hire racists. And those people omit best candidates who don't fit their bias because they don't believe those people are the best qualified.

We might debate whether there is any circumstance where diversity exists "for diversity sake" but even if it did, the company probably gets the same benefits. And we could debate popularity, but virtually every Fortune 500 company is recruiting to have a more diverse workforce,customer base and knowledge base.

It's simply a racist myth that highly qualified black and brown people don't exist. That's why, I think, some white people are trying to legislate against having to compete fairly.

(As a side note, everything I say is not an opinion. You'll usually find a fact or two. And my opinions are formed by learning facts although sometimes morality plays a role. I'm sure you're the same.)

 

[rcurtner]

Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

It happens when the owners are racist. Racists hire racists. And those people omit best candidates who don't fit their bias because they don't believe those people are the best qualified.

We might debate whether there is any circumstance where diversity exists "for diversity sake" but even if it did, the company probably gets the same benefits. And we could debate popularity, but virtually every Fortune 500 company is recruiting to have a more diverse workforce,customer base and knowledge base.

It's simply a racist myth that highly qualified black and brown people don't exist. That's why, I think, some white people are trying to legislate against having to compete fairly.

(As a side note, everything I say is not an opinion. You'll usually find a fact or two. And my opinions are formed by learning facts although sometimes morality plays a role. I'm sure you're the same.)

I appears you have stirred up a hornet's nest. You've made your point. Why don't we just move on? I'm being more polite than usual.

 

[Snake45]

I was straight up told I would be doing my work as well as “ other people’s work” and if I complained, I would be the one getting fired. I turned the job down. “ Diversity “ hires KNOW they aren’t going to be fired and they act accordingly. I see it every day where I work.

My daughter works at a federal agency and had EXACTLY the same experience, so I know you speak the truth.

 

[Snake45]

It happens when the owners are racist. Racists hire racists.

You are correct. And it happens when racists run the government, the education system, the unions, and corporations chasing $$$ controlled by the government---and so forth.

 

[Bassbob]

Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

It happens when the owners are racist. Racists hire racists. And those people omit best candidates who don't fit their bias because they don't believe those people are the best qualified.

We might debate whether there is any circumstance where diversity exists "for diversity sake" but even if it did, the company probably gets the same benefits. And we could debate popularity, but virtually every Fortune 500 company is recruiting to have a more diverse workforce,customer base and knowledge base.

It's simply a racist myth that highly qualified black and brown people don't exist. That's why, I think, some white people are trying to legislate against having to compete fairly.

(As a side note, everything I say is not an opinion. You'll usually find a fact or two. And my opinions are formed by learning facts although sometimes morality plays a role. I'm sure you're the same.)

That's a complete fantasy dreamed up by white liberals. It's clear you either have no experience in the real world as it pertains to large companies or you're just passing along progressive fantasies. If ( insert minority group here) were actually the best employees that's pretty much all companies would hire. Your fantasy hinges on the predication that the vast majority of large companies value racist ideology over profits. Which is ridiculous. Which with all due respect, so are almost all of your opinions.

 

[Snake45]

That's a complete fantasy dreamed up by white liberals. It's clear you either have no experience in the real world as it pertains to large companies or you're just passing along progressive fantasies. If ( insert minority group here) were actually the best employees that's pretty much all companies would hire. Your fantasy hinges on the predication that the vast majority of large companies value racist ideology over profits. Which is ridiculous. Which with all due respect, so are almost all of your opinions.

What's that sound I hear in reply? Crickets?

Figgers.

 

[jschmidt]

I for one was taught about slavery in most of my elementary school years. I've not learned anything about it in the last 10 yrs that I didn't already know.

Were you taught that the District of Columbia paid reparations—to the slaveholders. Or that as a child, Harriet Tubman had her skull broken for simply being in the way when her slavemaster wanted to punish someone else?

You may not have learned anything else, but there is a mountain of stuff to learn.

 

[jschmidt]

That's a complete fantasy dreamed up by white liberals. It's clear you either have no experience in the real world as it pertains to large companies or you're just passing along progressive fantasies. If ( insert minority group here) were actually the best employees that's pretty much all companies would hire. Your fantasy hinges on the predication that the vast majority of large companies value racist ideology over profits. Which is ridiculous. Which with all due respect, so are almost all of your opinions.

I can't tell you how many times I have heard of using this excuse to the person who didn't get the job.

Big companies are all doing exactly what you think they're not. Small companies are too. That ship has sailed brother. And if you're gonna start getting personal again I'm gonna start saying what I really think.

 

[jumpinjoe]

Were you taught that the District of Columbia paid reparations—to the slaveholders. Or that as a child, Harriet Tubman had her skull broken for simply being in the way when her slavemaster wanted to punish someone else?

You may not have learned anything else, but there is a mountain of stuff to learn.

You are referring I presume to the $300 compensation each slave owner was paid for the loss of the slave due to the Emancipation Proclamation signed by Pres Lincoln? That was not "reparation" as you've described it, it was gov't sponsored payment/compensation for lost personal property due to gov't action. There has never been any formal "reparation" paid in this country to anyone other than a slave named Belinda Royall in 1783 in the form of a pension.

And to even bring up the incident with Harriot Tubman shows your true intent. That is a single incident much like another slave stubbing their toe, or being thrown from the farm mule and breaking an arm, or being run over by a runaway team. These are not valid arguments, just examples of incidental things happening at a time in history when it was considered common. Was slavery valid, hell no, but then you must ask yourself how did all the slaves get here from their native lands ... actually ask how many were sold into slavery by their own kind or their own tribe from their own native country.

Throughout history of civilization, one man's house was built on top of another man's cave ... one man's village was built on that man's house ... one man's town was built on that man's village ... one man's city was built on that man's town, etc, etc, ... each one built by the victor over the weaker. Were any of them right or even acceptable, it depends on the time in history of it happening and one's own perception. But I'm pretty sure you know that, you just don't like it. And that's OK to not like it ... I don't like some of it. But we all have to accept it and move on. The answer is to see it never happens again rather than to keep opening a sore that needs to heal.

I'm not by any means supporting slavery of that time nor anytime. But it has been a natural and common part of life for many nations and people over the history of mankind, regardless of color or homeland. The fact is it still goes on today around the world when one tribe overcomes another tribe. To blame the USA or any other country for actions which at one time the majority of the world accepted as right is evidence of a very slanted viewpoint seeing it only as they prefer, and much less a viewpoint of the real world as it is now/today! That same person will often also not recognize the benefits and opportunities that this country has made them and I've not ever heard anyone say they would be willing to go back to the life where the slaves came from.

I personally will never be held responsible for any activity that happened prior to the late 1940's, nor will I ever agree that anyone today is in anyway responsible for it. Neither will I accept that anyone who today claims they're entitled to anything from that time in history deserves it, with a very few exceptions. I assure you I know plenty about slavery!!!

 

[rcurtner]

You are referring I presume to the $300 compensation each slave owner was paid for the loss of the slave due to the Emancipation Proclamation signed by Pres Lincoln? That was not "reparation" as you've described it, it was gov't sponsored payment/compensation for lost personal property due to gov't action. There has never been any formal "reparation" paid in this country to anyone other than a slave named Belinda Royall in 1783 in the form of a pension.

And to even bring up the incident with Harriot Tubman shows your true intent. That is a single incident much like another slave stubbing their toe, or being thrown from the farm mule and breaking an arm, or being run over by a runaway team. These are not valid arguments, just examples of incidental things happening at a time in history when it was considered common. Was slavery valid, hell no, but then you must ask yourself how did all the slaves get here from their native lands ... actually ask how many were sold into slavery by their own kind or their own tribe from their own native country.

Throughout history of civilization, one man's house was built on top of another man's cave ... one man's village was built on that man's house ... one man's town was built on that man's village ... one man's city was built on that man's town, etc, etc, ... each one built by the victor over the weaker. Were any of them right or even acceptable, it depends on the time in history of it happening and one's own perception. But I'm pretty sure you know that, you just don't like it. And that's OK to not like it ... I don't like some of it. But we all have to accept it and move on. The answer is to see it never happens again rather than to keep opening a sore that needs to heal.

I'm not by any means supporting slavery of that time nor anytime. But it has been a natural and common part of life for many nations and people over the history of mankind, regardless of color or homeland. The fact is it still goes on today around the world when one tribe overcomes another tribe. To blame the USA or any other country for actions which at one time the majority of the world accepted as right is evidence of a very slanted viewpoint seeing it only as they prefer, and much less a viewpoint of the real world as it is now/today! That same person will often also not recognize the benefits and opportunities that this country has made them and I've not ever heard anyone say they would be willing to go back to the life where the slaves came from.

I personally will never be held responsible for any activity that happened prior to the late 1940's, nor will I ever agree that anyone today is in anyway responsible for it. Neither will I accept that anyone who today claims they're entitled to anything from that time in history deserves it, with a very few exceptions. I assure you I know plenty about slavery!!!

Hopefully your very well written response will put an end to this thread. I'm half a** sorry I ever started it.

 

[jumpinjoe]

I can't tell you how many times I have heard of using this excuse to the person who didn't get the job.

Big companies are all doing exactly what you think they're not. Small companies are too. That ship has sailed brother. And if you're gonna start getting personal again I'm gonna start saying what I really think.

For you to claim that "big" companies bypass the best people due to their color, is asinine. Any company that did that on even a rare occasion would soon be out of business, big or small businesses. Businesses are made or broken by the people within it. And tell us please just what position you may have held where you have "heard of using this excuse to the person who didn't get the job" so many times you can't tell us.

Let me think just off the top of my head ... NAACP, Ms Black America, Ms Black USA, Affirmative action, National Organization for Blacks in Government, African American Planning Commission (AAPC), American Assn of Blacks in Energy, Blacks in Technology, ColorComm, The Executive Leadership Council, National Action Council for Minorities in Engineering, National Assn of African-American in Human Resources, National Black Chamber of Commerce, National Black Justice Commission, National Black MBA Assn, and the list goes on. What would be the upheaval of an organization called NOAWP? These are all benefits and advantages for blacks that some would call reparations. Respectfully I ask, what about you? What do you think?

 

[Bassbob]

I can't tell you how many times I have heard of using this excuse to the person who didn't get the job.

Big companies are all doing exactly what you think they're not. Small companies are too. That ship has sailed brother. And if you're gonna start getting personal again I'm gonna start saying what I really think.

Say what you want brother. It's not a threat to me because I don't care. I extended an olive branch and you responded not by looking for common ground, this being a gun forum and both of us allegedly being pro gun, rather you responded the exact opposite way to me in a PM and then proceeded to make about 7 troll posts in a row with absolutely ridiculous and provably false bullshite opinions in them.

By the way gramps, get your eyes checked. That other thread you claimed I was using 2011 stats in, it was 2021 stats. And frankly if you are trying to make the argument that most gun crime is committed by white wife beaters, which you were, and not young, urban, black males your opinions are absolutely ridiculous or just pulled out of your ass. Not even regular liberals believe that ****.

 

[jumpinjoe]

Hopefully your very well written response will put an end to this thread. I'm half a** sorry I ever started it.

Yeh, I've tried hard to be respectful to him, but I've about had it too!!!

 

[Bassbob]

For you to claim that "big" companies bypass the best people due to their color, is asinine. Any company that did that on even a rare occasion would soon be out of business, big or small businesses. Businesses are made or broken by the people within it. And tell us please just what position you may have held where you have "heard of using this excuse to the person who didn't get the job" so many times you can't tell us.

Let me think just off the top of my head ... NAACP, Ms Black America, Ms Black USA, Affirmative action, National Organization for Blacks in Government, African American Planning Commission (AAPC), American Assn of Blacks in Energy, Blacks in Technology, ColorComm, The Executive Leadership Council, National Action Council for Minorities in Engineering, National Assn of African-American in Human Resources, National Black Chamber of Commerce, National Black Justice Commission, National Black MBA Assn, and the list goes on. What would be the upheaval of an organization called NOAWP? These are all benefits and advantages for blacks that some would call reparations. Respectfully I ask, what about you? What do you think?

He can say what he wants, it's all bullshit. I work at a place where blacks almost can't be fired. And the big bosses and HR have admitted this to me. And the place I could have worked is the same way. And gobs of other people we all know work in places where it's the same way.

I've come to the conclusion he is trolling and hard. I don't think he's pro gun at all and the only reason he's posting here is to stir up ****.

 

[rcurtner]

He can say what he wants, it's all bullshit. I work at a place where blacks almost can't be fired. And the big bosses and HR have admitted this to me. And the place I could have worked is the same way. And gobs of other people we all know work in places where it's the same way.

I've come to the conclusion he is trolling and hard. I don't think he's pro gun at all and the only reason he's posting here is to stir up ****.

I try hard to be open minded but this guy is way out of line. He's trying to use this forum to spread untruths that a lot of us don't agree with. There are probably liberal members on this forum but I haven't read crap like this guy is putting out.

 

[Bassbob]

I try hard to be open minded but this guy is way out of line. He's trying to use this forum to spread untruths that a lot of us don't agree with. There are probably liberal members on this forum but I haven't read crap this this guy is putting out.

I have friends on this forum that are liberals. I think ( and I think they agree) that searching for common ground is important and a good way to open people's minds up to different points of view. JSchmidt only posts in threads that are controversial and only to pose a dramatically opposite POV than everyone else. Does he participate in any threads about, I don't know, guns? Not many. I think he would be more at home on a political web forum. I'm not real sure why he's here, but one thing's for sure, it's not to forge relationships, explore different points of view and express his point of view in a way that isn't designed to fire people up ( aka trolling). It's also not to do what this forum is designed to do. Allow people to discuss and share thoughts, information and opinions about firearms and 2A topics. From his own posts it's pretty clear that he is not pro 2A. He is pro Biden's idea of what the 2A means. I would be willing to bet he's a card carrying member of at least one " Firearm Safety coalition". Brady, Bloomberg, one of them.

 

[jumpinjoe]

He can say what he wants, it's all bullshit. I work at a place where blacks almost can't be fired. And the big bosses and HR have admitted this to me. And the place I could have worked is the same way. And gobs of other people we all know work in places where it's the same way.

I've come to the conclusion he is trolling and hard. I don't think he's pro gun at all and the only reason he's posting here is to stir up ****.

Yeah, I know what he's up to, I just wanted to see how far he'd go. I recently retired from a very unique and brand new position as a non-union/classified representative assigned to the administrative side of a big organization ... approx 5000 employees, more than 300 my direct reports. A first time position in which I could see both/either side and I was very fortunate to sit in on. I served in that position for more that 16 years and saw/heard every conceivable bargaining position, every disciplinary event, every termination effort, every argument, etc. I saw so many good/bad from every angle I can't begin to tell you, or something like that. I know exactly what he's up to, but he just ain't that good at it yet. Maybe as he gets a little older and gains some experience he'll be better at it and I'll be more respectful.