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Find the Right Carry Gun, Not Necessarily the Smallest One

Agreed.

I sold motorcycles for more than 10 years. Every day, someone would come in and say "my buddy says I should get a..."...and the "buddy" was totally wrong. 5'4", 110 lbs...on a 700 lb Street Glide? Um...no.

So, I would start at square one. "What kind of riding are you going to do?". "Solo or two-up?" And so on. Once we narrowed that down, and I'd sized up the person's physique, experience, and general coordination, we'd start looking at - and sitting on - actual motorcycles.

I'd save the buddy's choice for last.

Generally, all the "oooh, I like this" and "this fits me", were totally different bikes from what the buddy suggested.

I'd tell folks "sit on every bike you can find. Eventually one of them will grab you around the throat, shake you, and scream in your face 'I'M THE ONE FOR YOU!!!!!' - and I guarantee a) it'll be one you never expected, and b) it WON'T be the one your buddy suggested."

When I was shopping for my first EDC...I tried everything in the rental case. Twice. Got about halfway through the retail case, too. I shot well enough with the Shield. I hated the Glocks. I enjoyed the Sig...enjoyed the 1911s but a little big for me to realistically carry...but nothing grabbed me. Then, qualification day arrived for my CCW class, and I was (pardon the pun) under the gun to find something. I'd been researching, and was looking at the P365, and the XDs. They had 2 XDs's in the case - black, with the small backstrap installed, and gray with the large backstrap installed.

The gray one grabbed me by the throat and screamed at me, as soon as I picked it up.

They had some leftover 9mm rounds, so I loaded 5 (the last in the box). Target out to 7 yards. 5 rounds through 3 holes, all in a 1.5" group.

Sold.

Qualifications? 4 targets. 250, 248, 248, 250.

Been carrying it ever since, and love every bit of it. Discreet enough for my lanky ass to hide it...large enough for my big paws to keep a steady grip on it. On target fast, BACK on target fast.

Some folks may say "that's a cute gun for a big guy to carry". Some folks may say "only a 9mm?" Some folks may say "get a real gun".

To those, I say...let's go to the range, and I'll show you why I carry this one.

Carry what you shoot well, and screw everything else. When the chips are down and the SHTF, you don't need "image" and you don't need "status" - you need rounds on target. Period. Do what it takes to get that.
 
Peglegjoe said:
Agreed.

I sold motorcycles for more than 10 years. Every day, someone would come in and say "my buddy says I should get a..."...and the "buddy" was totally wrong. 5'4", 110 lbs...on a 700 lb Street Glide? Um...no.

So, I would start at square one. "What kind of riding are you going to do?". "Solo or two-up?" And so on. Once we narrowed that down, and I'd sized up the person's physique, experience, and general coordination, we'd start looking at - and sitting on - actual motorcycles.

I'd save the buddy's choice for last.

Generally, all the "oooh, I like this" and "this fits me", were totally different bikes from what the buddy suggested.

I'd tell folks "sit on every bike you can find. Eventually one of them will grab you around the throat, shake you, and scream in your face 'I'M THE ONE FOR YOU!!!!!' - and I guarantee a) it'll be one you never expected, and b) it WON'T be the one your buddy suggested."

When I was shopping for my first EDC...I tried everything in the rental case. Twice. Got about halfway through the retail case, too. I shot well enough with the Shield. I hated the Glocks. I enjoyed the Sig...enjoyed the 1911s but a little big for me to realistically carry...but nothing grabbed me. Then, qualification day arrived for my CCW class, and I was (pardon the pun) under the gun to find something. I'd been researching, and was looking at the P365, and the XDs. They had 2 XDs's in the case - black, with the small backstrap installed, and gray with the large backstrap installed.

The gray one grabbed me by the throat and screamed at me, as soon as I picked it up.

They had some leftover 9mm rounds, so I loaded 5 (the last in the box). Target out to 7 yards. 5 rounds through 3 holes, all in a 1.5" group.

Sold.

Qualifications? 4 targets. 250, 248, 248, 250.

Been carrying it ever since, and love every bit of it. Discreet enough for my lanky ass to hide it...large enough for my big paws to keep a steady grip on it. On target fast, BACK on target fast.

Some folks may say "that's a cute gun for a big guy to carry". Some folks may say "only a 9mm?" Some folks may say "get a real gun".

To those, I say...let's go to the range, and I'll show you why I carry this one.

Carry what you shoot well, and screw everything else. When the chips are down and the SHTF, you don't need "image" and you don't need "status" - you need rounds on target. Period. Do what it takes to get that.
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Your absolutely right, I've owned many bikes over the years and guns also, when it fits correctly it's part of you.
 
CCW= Concealed Carry Weapon. With so many points that get brought up on shoot the biggest gun you can handle or carry one that holds the most rounds......I know guys that will qualify with a revolver shooting it upside down and get a perfect score. True story. 5/6 shot revolver in 38spcl that was the standard for many years and also conceals well with the holster options we have and even have 38 lite loads for the recoil sensitive. Of course you would like to carry an effective 45acp in a compact package and I’m sure most of us can handle that. 45acp will usually dispatch what it hits. In it’s compact state you will lose a few rounds of capacity over the 9mm. The 9mm, Hellcat for example, with 10 rounds is almost invisible, perfect for almost all 3 seasons we have. With the available and effective options ranging from .22lr/mag to 10mm (G29) no reason for anyone not to have something to carry.
 
I think a Hellcat would be a good 4-season gun. It's not THAT much bigger/thicker than my XDs, and I cycle with my XDs - in shorts and a tank top. Hunched over to reach the bars on my mountain bike. And nobody (including the MD Park Police officers I spoke with the other day, just shooting the breeze while I sipped some water and took my pulse after a big hill climb) notices.
 
Peglegjoe said:
I think a Hellcat would be a good 4-season gun. It's not THAT much bigger/thicker than my XDs, and I cycle with my XDs - in shorts and a tank top. Hunched over to reach the bars on my mountain bike. And nobody (including the MD Park Police officers I spoke with the other day, just shooting the breeze while I sipped some water and took my pulse after a big hill climb) notices.
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I say 3 season due to the fact in the winter months it allows for the concealment of a full-size, or larger capacity pistol.
 
One thing you end up noticing after you carry for a while is that most people don’t notice you carrying, period. You’ve got to pretty obviously open carry before anyone sees it...and even then, you’ll be surprised how many people still are oblivious.

Another thing—you can effectively conceal a big gun—I’m talking full-sized duty pistol, like a 1911 Gov’t Model, or Beretta 92, XDM, 4” 686, etc-with very little effort. All it takes is a good belt, a good holster, and a little bit of dressing around the gun.

But, it takes effort on the carrier’s part to do that; some people don’t want to make that effort...and will choose a tiny, hard to shoot gun that they don’t enjoy shooting, and therefore don’t practice with enough to become truly proficient with. I like to refer to this as the “LCP Phenomenon”, because of all the many people I know who carry LCP’s or similar, very, very few put more than 50-100 rounds through it.
 
I prefer to have ONE carry gun. ONE set of muscle memory. ONE set of sights to get used to. ONE set of controls to teach to my hands.

Would I like a 1911? Absolutely. But if I start carrying one...it'll be the ONLY one I carry, for those reasons.

I own multiple motorcycles, and when I go from one to the other it takes a few miles to really settle into the different machine. I know them all extremely well - my newest is a 2009 that I bought brand new - but there is still a transitional phase that I would prefer not to run into should I ever need to use my sidearm under duress.
 
KillerFord1977 said:
In this day and age of cell phones, most men have an untucked shirt with their cell phone on their belt. People are used to seeing that “profile” if you will. A large frame pistol almost has the same shape/profile and no one gives a look anymore with prolific cell phone culture
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You know I'd never thought of that, but you're absolutely correct. Great point.
 
Peglegjoe said:
I think a Hellcat would be a good 4-season gun. It's not THAT much bigger/thicker than my XDs, and I cycle with my XDs - in shorts and a tank top. Hunched over to reach the bars on my mountain bike. And nobody (including the MD Park Police officers I spoke with the other day, just shooting the breeze while I sipped some water and took my pulse after a big hill climb) notices.
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What's this "4-season" thing you are talking about? Around here, we really only get two - wet and dry. If I'm not going into work where I'm not allowed to carry, I'm in shorts and a t-shirt year round. Sometimes throw on a sweatshirt when it gets "cold" (i.e., 60 degrees or so).

I've been carrying my XD-E .45 for a while, but my wife recently picked up a Sig P938 for her carry pistol, and it was very comfy in my hand, so I decided I should try out something like that for me as well. Tried the 911, and was immediately shooting much better with it than any of the pistols I've owned. So once it's back from Springfield and I've confirmed that the failure to load gremlins have been fixed, that will likely be my primary carry gun. I think it's funny as I am not a small person (6'2", 260, with both large and lanky hands), and the smallest gun I own is the easiest for me to shoot accurately.
 
HansGruber said:
One thing you end up noticing after you carry for a while is that most people don’t notice you carrying, period. You’ve got to pretty obviously open carry before anyone sees it...and even then, you’ll be surprised how many people still are oblivious.

Another thing—you can effectively conceal a big gun—I’m talking full-sized duty pistol, like a 1911 Gov’t Model, or Beretta 92, XDM, 4” 686, etc-with very little effort. All it takes is a good belt, a good holster, and a little bit of dressing around the gun.

But, it takes effort on the carrier’s part to do that; some people don’t want to make that effort...and will choose a tiny, hard to shoot gun that they don’t enjoy shooting, and therefore don’t practice with enough to become truly proficient with. I like to refer to this as the “LCP Phenomenon”, because of all the many people I know who carry LCP’s or similar, very, very few put more than 50-100 rounds through it.
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This is absolutely true. Even people who are trained to spot it will miss it with just a little bit of effort. And by people trained to spot it I'm not talking about regular police officers because most of them really aren't paying attention to that unless YOU are a problem. Good belt, good holster, loose clothing, not fidgeting around with your ****, pretty simple.
 
From the article: She said a bigger, heavier gun would not deter her from carrying concealed because she carries a larger purse and is accustomed to lugging a heavy work bag daily.

First huge mistake, comparing a two pound firearm that should be carried on your person to a purse or bag at which you ARE going to set down at some point. Not a fan of off body carry at all, for a host of reasons.
 
I totally agree that the best gun is one that fits one's hands comfortably is very important. Generalities never work out very well, and what is right for one person is not right for another one.

That said, weight is always an issue if one is going to carry day in and day out seven days a week. It becomes more of an issue for those who lead very active lifestyles with lots of movements. Climate is also a factor as is type of job. What I can carry in a suit in Chicago may not be a very good choice of a summer construction worker in Florida or Arizona or, even worse, New Mexico where concealment is more important.

If size and weight were not a problem I would be carrying a Commander sized 1911, which I used to carry for years until Glock introduced the 30 and later the 36. Finally the XDs solved the problem altogether for me. For my wife the solution is a Boberg (now Bond Arms) but a lot of shooters, male and female, would hate the way the gun loads and the fact it needs to be kept clean and properly greased.

Everyone is different and has a different set of needs.
 
Small =/= good...usually.

A smaller gun will have heavier recoil, br harder to control, a bit more difficult to aim...

But:

This can also be relative, depending on the shooter.

I find S&W J-frames (subcompact, snub revolvers) to be incredibly pointable, controllable (even shooting Magnum loads worthy of the moniker) and easy to carry...I often carry one as a BUG, or carry two as primary/BUG...and while I don’t try to deliberately go in harm’s way, I’ve never felt inadequate so braced when it's happened.

Also, the Colt Mustang/Sig 238/Kimber Micro/911 are incredibly accurate little pistols...even in circumstances where a more “covert“ carry mode is required, these are a fair amount of firepower in a small package.
 
Gun magazines are entertainment. They are not professional journals. Most articles published in gun magazines aren't worth time required to read them. This article is an exception. It cogently refutes urban legend of some guns as better fits for women and the whole population of survivors. Women are capable of firing .45 ACP handguns with exceptional proficiency. I've seen petite women qualify w/o difficulty using large caliber handguns. Contrary to urban legend that's often repeated by the naive on gun forums, cops must qualify with their duty weapons to exacting standards, which are generally a qualifying score of a minimum of 80%. If a cop cannot qualify, he'll be given additional training. If he's ultimately unable to qualify, he'll be deemed unfit for employment for failure to meet minimum standards.

Gun store clerks instinctively and with illusory knowledge steer women toward small caliber handguns as though women are not capable of managing a large caliber handgun. That is fallacy.

There are definite realities that have to be considered when buying a handgun that's intended for concealed carry. Before buying a handgun for self-defense, one must have clear understanding of its intended use. A person who is routinely in gang diseased areas would want to consider a handgun that holds a lot of rounds and is easy to reload. Gang bangers rarely do bad things alone. The safe rule is bangers maraud in packs. A woman whose primary concern is defense against a lone sexual predator would be well served with a .38 Special belly gun.

Environmental factors might be a concern, but I think they're over-emphasized to justify carrying a person's favorite handgun. If one is willing to wear a suitable outer garment such as a trench coat, he could conceal an 870. If I lived in a locale where winter temperatures would facilitate igloo communities, I'd carry a handgun in an outer coat's pocket. The idea is immediate access to a handgun if I were in imminent threat of death or great bodily injury. I would not want to waste time peeling away items of clothing to gain access to a handgun.

Handgun size is a dominant criterion. So is weight. Control is another dominant criterion. I'd pay to watch a hand gunner rapid fire magnum rounds from a belly gun. I own a Model 60. When loaded with the FBI load, it is unwieldy. Recoil jerks its muzzle off target, which is a potentially fatal tactical disadvantage. A handgun's muzzle must remain on a threat. Reacquiring sight picture can result in fatal consequences.

I've carried various off-duty handguns. Some are much easier to carry and conceal than others. If it were practicable, I'd carry only my Springfield Armory TRP .45 ACP. While easy to conceal, when loaded with 230 grain ammo, it is prohibitively heavy. All the rage in concealable handguns seems to be featherweights. Who wouldn't want to carry a 16 oz, high capacity handgun? It's far more complicated than weight. A handgun is useless for self-defense if it's not as close to 100% reliable as any mechanical device can get. How difficult would it be to keep a featherweight's muzzle pointed at a threat? Hence, weight is not the controlling criterion.

People become confused by parameters established by entertainers (gun magazine writers). People in the market for self-defense handguns must establish parameters that are suitable for them. There are definite and quantifiable attributes to self-defense handguns. Size is one such attribute.

After decades of experience, my opinion is that for urban carry, the Springfield Armory EMP 3 is closest to perfection. It's added weight vis-a-vis featherweights is an attribute. It enhances my ability to keep it's muzzle on target. Moreover, would a survivor really notice the 8 ounce differential? Assuming it would be noticeable, would one accept the added weight for the tactical advantage of retaining sight picture?

Once final and extremely crucial point: really bad guys will look for indicators that a person is carrying a concealed handgun. What they're trying to identify is off-duty cops. Really bad guys practice taking handguns from concealed carriers. A practiced bad guy can disarm a concealed carrier before he realizes he's been disarmed. Depending upon where one lives, if a person (a store clerk or waitress) were to see a handgun on a person who's legally able to carry it, assume she'll call cops. Cops wil have no clue of who you are. When they arrive, they will prone out the identified person who's legally carrying a handgun. A college friend, who was a cop in a crime-plagued LA County city got such a call. He maneuvered his way undetected behind the "suspect" carrying a concealed handgun. He shoved his 1911-A1 in the person's back while pulling his head back by his hair and said, "@*@*, I hope you're a cop!" The man replied, "LA County deputy sheriff." His agency ID card verified him as a sworn aw enforcement officer, which ended the encounter. The point is an ordinary citizen detected the deputy's concealed handgun and called cops. It might be a severe judgment error to assume a concealed handgun is undetectable.
 
HansGruber said:
One thing you end up noticing after you carry for a while is that most people don’t notice you carrying, period. You’ve got to pretty obviously open carry before anyone sees it...and even then, you’ll be surprised how many people still are oblivious.

Another thing—you can effectively conceal a big gun—I’m talking full-sized duty pistol, like a 1911 Gov’t Model, or Beretta 92, XDM, 4” 686, etc-with very little effort. All it takes is a good belt, a good holster, and a little bit of dressing around the gun.

But, it takes effort on the carrier’s part to do that; some people don’t want to make that effort...and will choose a tiny, hard to shoot gun that they don’t enjoy shooting, and therefore don’t practice with enough to become truly proficient with. I like to refer to this as the “LCP Phenomenon”, because of all the many people I know who carry LCP’s or similar, very, very few put more than 50-100 rounds through it.
[/QI agree,unless I am doing pocket carry,it is a K frame or 1911.You need the right holster and belt.
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