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First Look: SAINT Victor 9mm Carbine

HansGruber said:
Move the goalposts much?

Your original post said you had two carbines, a Kriss and a MechTech. Neither are even vaguely considered AR platforms.

Additionally, you saying you had issues with whatever brand of 10mm AR only reinforces my earlier point…10mm AR’s are unreliable.
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Kriss was never about the gun , only the mags. And yes, mec-tech isn't an AR (I know), but still a good carbine..
 
greywolf1961 said:
In my opinion, SA made a huge error in using the Colt SMG magazines. They are more difficult to find and not compatible with any other firearm. This would have been a much more desirable carbine if they had configured it to use XD magazines. Even Glock magazines would have been better, but that would mean admitting that Glock had better magazines.

Having magazine compatibility with your sidearm is really a much better idea, regardless of caliber.
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Colt mags are compatible with Tavor in 9mm...Hard to load without them without the maglula.
 
greywolf1961 said:
In my opinion, SA made a huge error in using the Colt SMG magazines. They are more difficult to find and not compatible with any other firearm. This would have been a much more desirable carbine if they had configured it to use XD magazines. Even Glock magazines would have been better, but that would mean admitting that Glock had better magazines.

Having magazine compatibility with your sidearm is really a much better idea, regardless of caliber.
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Huh??? Metalform and DuraMag magazines everywhere.
 
HansGruber said:
They aren’t hard to find at all…and you can also do an easy DIY mod to an Uzi mag and they’ll work great.

And using XD/XDm mags would condemn this rifle to death. Nobody except a few diehard fanboys would buy it.
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I have extensive experience with Colt 9mm SMG with my last Agency. I will just say Colt 9mm mags are horrible. There was only a couple Hollow Points it would feed without the bolt pushing the bullet halfway into the case.

They are hard to seat even if download from 32 to 30 rounds and if dropped it’s an instant PEZ dispenser and half if not more live rounds are spewed all over.

We went to HK MP5’s and never looked back. At least until we dropped the 9mm SMG and went back to rifles.

Hopefully SA redid some internals and they work better than the Colts but don't drop a loaded magazine you will loose rounds!
 
ECS686 said:
I have extensive experience with Colt 9mm SMG with my last Agency. I will just say Colt 9mm mags are horrible. There was only a couple Hollow Points it would feed without the bolt pushing the bullet halfway into the case.

They are hard to seat even if download from 32 to 30 rounds and if dropped it’s an instant PEZ dispenser and half if not more live rounds are spewed all over.

We went to HK MP5’s and never looked back. At least until we dropped the 9mm SMG and went back to rifles.

Hopefully SA redid some internals and they work better than the Colts but don't drop a loaded magazine you will loose rounds!
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I’ve run my buddy’s SBR’d 635 upper on a Rock River 9mm lower, never had issues…mainly with C-Products and Metalform magazines, can’t ever recall having an issue; same with my Colt 6951 when I had it.

Brownells 9mm SMG mags work great, as well…
 
To bring this back around to the firearm at hand... I'm also a little disappointed. The more I've learned about the new SA PCC the more I understand why they went with the Colt spec mag, but... they have the XDM 35 round mags but just pistols that take them. Maybe there's something else in the works but I would've expected more of a basic AR lower with an adapter to allow SA XDM or Glock mags. Doing this would also allow both 9mm and 45ACP uppers, along with much more flexibility with builds, etc. Maybe there are oddball mechanics that make it difficult. I still like SA products but their marketing and product planning have let me down recently. (I don't normally comment like this but I had to vent a little bit).
 
HansGruber said:
I’ve run my buddy’s SBR’d 635 upper on a Rock River 9mm lower, never had issues…mainly with C-Products and Metalform magazines, can’t ever recall having an issue; same with my Colt 6951 when I had it.

Brownells 9mm SMG mags work great, as well…
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Maybe howeve I am basing my experience of witnessing several dozen different Colt SMGs over several years. From running annual qualifications to SORT Training to when I taught new agency Firearms Instructors at FLETC.

So it wasn’t an isolated incident. With Colt and a Colt Magazines it will happen if you use it enough.
 
Motrhedx81 said:
To bring this back around to the firearm at hand... I'm also a little disappointed. The more I've learned about the new SA PCC the more I understand why they went with the Colt spec mag, but... they have the XDM 35 round mags but just pistols that take them. Maybe there's something else in the works but I would've expected more of a basic AR lower with an adapter to allow SA XDM or Glock mags. Doing this would also allow both 9mm and 45ACP uppers, along with much more flexibility with builds, etc. Maybe there are oddball mechanics that make it difficult. I still like SA products but their marketing and product planning have let me down recently. (I don't normally comment like this but I had to vent a little bit).
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AR magwell adapters are, in my experience, a lot less reliable than a dedicated magwell.

That’s a very good reason to not be able to swap for an uncommonly used mag, imho.
 
I can't see myself paying $1200 for any direct blowback PCC. There are better systems. And even if they cost a little more, the difference in the shooting experience is totally worth it, imo.

I also don't see much point in a PCC that is as large, and as heavy, as a rifle caliber AR. The advantage to PCC platforms, in my mind, is when they are compact and light enough to offer something a full size AR doesn't.
 
Hammer67 said:
I can't see myself paying $1200 for any direct blowback PCC. There are better systems. And even if they cost a little more, the difference in the shooting experience is totally worth it, imo.

I also don't see much point in a PCC that is as large, and as heavy, as a rifle caliber AR. The advantage to PCC platforms, in my mind, is when they are compact and light enough to offer something a full size AR doesn't.
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Roller locked or nothin’.
 
ECS686 said:
Maybe howeve I am basing my experience of witnessing several dozen different Colt SMGs over several years. From running annual qualifications to SORT Training to when I taught new agency Firearms Instructors at FLETC.

So it wasn’t an isolated incident. With Colt and a Colt Magazines it will happen if you use it enough.
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I haven't experienced your issues while owning and shooting Colt 9mms for the last 32 years. Maybe poor training or maintenance could have contributed.
 
deadduck357 said:
I haven't experienced your issues while owning and shooting Colt 9mms for the last 32 years. Maybe poor training or maintenance could have contributed.
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Not a training issue and these were bit new and range mags. When dropped onto concrete more times than not rounds were kicked out. And the only JHP that we could find the Fed was Winchester Ranger. Silvertip, Fed 9BP and HST about 2/3 times a mag it caugh ton the chamber and was pushed into the case.

I get there’s a market for 9mm PCC with the gun games. And If a 9mm rifle is what one wants for any other reasons have at it but there’s a reason most agencies dumped the SMG and went back to a rifle.
 
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