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Going Too Far: Self-Defense Vs. Excessive Force

Snake45 said:
Gonna have to stop you right there in your rather excellent story. 1999 was another country, a long time ago from WokeMerica 2024. Everything was VERY different then/there. ;)
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LOL well if it’s any help a couple shootings both Civilian
And Police the current prosecutor has cleared in a week so there’s that
 
HansGruber said:
Byron Smith was the shooter; happened in Little Falls, MN in 2012.

Feel free to look into the details on your own, but…unless my memory seriously has failed me, that’s the basics.
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They did a Dateline on this? Dude was wrong for this.
 
ECS686 said:
LOL well if it’s any help a couple shootings both Civilian
And Police the current prosecutor has cleared in a week so there’s that
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Good for you AND God Bless them. Every day this is the case is a blessing; give sincere thanks for it. Not everyone in WokeMerica 2024 is so fortunate. :confused:
 
ECS686 said:
How rude of me to leave this reference out

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Didn't bother to watch that. But I'll go back and do it IF you tell me that Vanity or Apolonia or Sheena E is in it. I was never a huge Prince fan--always thought he was a bit fruity for my taste--but he DID always have, as The Lovely Mrs Snake might put it, muy lindas putas around him all the time. ;)

 
HansGruber said:
There was a case here in MN a few years ago that perfectly illustrates this point.

A guy was having problems with burglaries in his home. So…he made it look like he wasn’t home; guy broke in, he shot—but didn’t kill—him. Few minutes later, burglar’s girlfriend enters home. Shoots but doesn’t kill her. Both are incapacitated.

So far—clean shoot, imho, and by MN law.

Then, after taunting them for a while…

Yeah. He was recording this.

Anyway, he shoots them both in the head.

And then calls the cops…the next day. After consulting with his brother.

He’s rotting in prison on two life sentences for 1st degree murder, and, imho, rightfully so.
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You’re right. He was fine with the initial response. What followed was nothing more or less than an execution. You have to wonder “why”” the guy would have thought that was ok.
 
LEO's are required to attend training before they can become a certified law enforcement officer. There may be exceptions, but some of that training involves, 'shoot, don't shoot' scenarios. Is it unreasonable to expect that before someone is issued a ccw permit that they be familiar with the same 'shoot, don't shoot' standards that apply to LEO's? Just sayin'!
 
Tenbones said:
LEO's are required to attend training before they can become a certified law enforcement officer. There may be exceptions, but some of that training involves, 'shoot, don't shoot' scenarios. Is it unreasonable to expect that before someone is issued a ccw permit that they be familiar with the same 'shoot, don't shoot' standards that apply to LEO's? Just sayin'!
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It is if you mean to make it mandatory. Nothing about that in the constitution. Better than half the country doesn't need a permit.

Of course I would wholeheartedly support CCW classes having those drills and a lot of other actual training in them. As it is a CCW course is only useful for informing you of the laws pertaining to carrying and deadly force, all of which can be gotten for free off the internet. My issue comes with mandating people take ANY class before they are allowed to exercise their fundamental right to self defense.
 
Bassbob said:
And I'll rebut, not enough to lose sleep over and certainly not enough to entertain any crazy ideas about any dumb new laws.
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As a nation we’d be on heck of a lot better off if government would just enforce the laws on the books rather than waste time, energy and $$ trying to create new ones. MANY years ago there was a article (American Rifleman) that pointed out that the USA had MORE “gun laws” than any other nation on earth.
 
Tenbones said:
LEO's are required to attend training before they can become a certified law enforcement officer. There may be exceptions, but some of that training involves, 'shoot, don't shoot' scenarios. Is it unreasonable to expect that before someone is issued a ccw permit that they be familiar with the same 'shoot, don't shoot' standards that apply to LEO's? Just sayin'!
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What other constitutionally protected civil liberties would you attach a training requirement to?
 
Tenbones said:
LEO's are required to attend training before they can become a certified law enforcement officer. There may be exceptions, but some of that training involves, 'shoot, don't shoot' scenarios. Is it unreasonable to expect that before someone is issued a ccw permit that they be familiar with the same 'shoot, don't shoot' standards that apply to LEO's? Just sayin'!
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:mad:
 
CAPMARINE276 said:
Why should she be shooting, he is only asking directions to the nearest 7-11. From a picture you are saying use DF?
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