Is Bear Spray Better Than a Pistol?

[Kodiak Cowboy]

I don’t think that most people really have a good feel for either just how big or just how fast a Brown Bear may be. Full grown Coastal Brownies in Alaska can average 1100 pounds and move at 35 mph (read a 6 second 100yard dash) more over they can take a heard an lung shot an still have enough living time to take you out.

What he said.
The same thing can be said about Huge interior Griz!

 

[Talyn]

What he said.
The same thing can be said about Huge interior Griz!

You folks may call them "interior" griz but down here they're just Northern Rockies bears.

The Cabinet/Yaak and Selkirk griz run smaller since their Recovery Areas aren't as productive food wise as the NCDE & GYE areas. The populations in the two latter areas are expanding out of those defined areas.

 

[Kodiak Cowboy]

You folks may call them "interior" griz but down here they're just Northern Rockies bears.

The Cabinet/Yaak and Selkirk griz run smaller since their Recovery Areas aren't as productive food wise as the NCDE & GYE areas. The populations in the two latter areas are expanding out of those defined areas.

I myself call them "a whole lot of speed and power" that I'd just rather avoid all together!

 

[Kodiak Cowboy]

You don't want to cross paths with those in either size.

Agreed.

 

[Recusant]

Hey Kodiak Cowboy, it's good to see you back and posting on the forum. Crossing paths with a griz or big Brown bear is probably not something I'll ever have to worry about since I don't plan to hike in big bear country.

 

[Annihilator]

Pistol possible bear.
View attachment 35898

High power rifle required bear.
View attachment 35896

Pistol possible bear.
View attachment 35897

High power rifle required bear.
View attachment 35895

Any questions?

After seeing these pics, I ain’t going back into any woods again, I’ll stay on the concrete jungle…….

 

[Talyn]

After seeing these pics, I ain’t going back into any woods again, I’ll stay on the concrete jungle…….

I'll take griz over the Zombie hordes in your area.

 

[HayesGreener]

I'll take griz over the Zombie hordes in your area.

 

[Kodiak Cowboy]

Ill

Hey Kodiak Cowboy, it's good to see you back and posting on the forum. Crossing paths with a griz or big Brown bear is probably not something I'll ever have to worry about since I don't plan to hike in big bear country.

I'll take Bear over Rattle Snakes and Black Widows any day of the decade! @Talyn probably has to deal with all three in the great state of Wyoming!
No thankyou! Not I!

 

[Talyn]

Ill

I'll take Bear over Rattle Snakes and Black Widows any day of the decade! @Talyn probably has to deal with all three in the great state of Wyoming!
No thankyou! Not I!

Not in WY but snakes do give me the willies.

Haven't seen any Black Widows in my area but we do have a nice selection of creepy crawlers in Big Sky Country.

 

[Recusant]

Ill

I'll take Bear over Rattle Snakes and Black Widows any day of the decade! @Talyn probably has to deal with all three in the great state of Wyoming!
No thankyou! Not I!

In central Virginia, copperheads are found frequently in urban areas. There are rattlesnakes out at my cabin in western Va , but the area around the house is not rocky and is far enough where the snakes den up for the winter. I know that snakes move through the area during summer. The rule is never stick your hands or feet somewhere you haven't checked out first.

 

[PeteinAlaska]

Just a couple you all might be interested in seeing …
The one with the Salmon is about a three year old Kodiak, the other is a SE Brownie maybe 3 or 4 taken just south of Sitka…
Gives an idea of size…. That Salmon is about 30 inches or so, the paw is about 10.5 inches across. The brownie weighed in at about 890lb but he was a youngster still.

 

[Kodiak Cowboy]

Just a couple you all might be interested in seeing …
The one with the Salmon is about a three year old Kodiak, the other is a SE Brownie maybe 3 or 4 taken just south of Sitka…
Gives an idea of size…. That Salmon is about 30 inches or so, the paw is about 10.5 inches across. The brownie weighed in at about 890lb but he was a youngster still.

Right on man! Good on ya!
This Kodiak was a young'n too. Also at three or four years old. Estimated weight was between 800-900 taken during the fall hunting season for Kodiak Brown Bear. At seven inches across the front pad. His front definitely wasn't as big as your bears paw! On Kodiak, rule of thumb is. What ever the pad measures across? Add an inch snd that's what the hide will square in feet. For example. This bears front pad was 7 inches across. His hide squared 8.3 foot.

This bear was a three year old sub adult. Taken during the Spring hunting season for Kodiak Bear. A community nuance beer becoming a bigger problem every day. He was between 400-500 lbs. Probably around the 450 range.

Front pad was six inches across.

The hide squared seven foot exactly.
Six foot from nose to tail. Eight foot from front middle claw tip, to front middle claw tip. For an average of 7 foot.

For those that don't know? Thats how a bears size is measured. Any species of bear! With the exception of their weight measurement.

 

[Katadin4570]

I live in North Texas, no grizzlies here at present. But, I enjoyed the article’s focus on OC spray. I lead and train a church security team and have often given thought to the utility of less-than-lethal means of defense. Our principal objective is to stop any threat outside the confines of the buildings themselves. In that environment, I think pepper spray could have an application, but…owing to the potential consequences of deploying this product improperly…training relative to how and when to use it would be absolutely essential to ensure the defender himself is not rendered ineffective as well. Have to think about this some more…

 

[Katadin4570]

Aren't you supposed to save one round for youself in case everything else fails?

A very astute observation and humerous as well! I like it !

 

[Katadin4570]

I loved the story about conservationists recommending you carry bear spray and wear bells to ward off griz on the trail. And the guide who says it is easy to identify griz poo because it has little bells in it and smells like peppers.

I need to remember this when I venture into bear country as I suspect I might have difficulty distinguishing one species of bear track from another otherwise. Thanks for the tip…!

 

[Katadin4570]

It was an interesting video. What I found a bit conflicting was bear spray @ 4 second full discharge at 20-30 ft and if it doesn't stop the attack, drawn (or have at-ready) the sidearm to continue the fight, which the author accomplished in training mode, 7 rounds in 6 seconds on target.

Let’s suppose 20 feet, 4 sec. blast of bear spray, followed up with 6 seconds of gun fire…and likely charging bear speed will cover probably that 20 ft. in - 1 second...and that’s if a bear is applying the Tueller Rule. Time is a luxury.

It’s going to take a good amount of practice… or narrow the choice of the two options?
I don’t know but I think if a bear is already in charge mode at 20-30 ft, it’s a darn good to convince me it isn’t just going to stop on the dime. I wouldn’t want to be in a predicament to guess wind direction and when seconds count, trying to fog it’s snout before it takes a swipe at me.

I don’t spend any time in the backwoods of any bear country but the kids do and have expressed interest in the .44 though never shot one. The only advice I could render is to find so with a .44, then try out (my) .38 spl, .38 +P, then a .357 magnum load for a feel. Then try getting 6 rounds on a 12” bullseye as fast as possible with each of the three loads. Finally while still fresh, try 6 with the .44 magnum.

I forwarded them the article, hopefully it will shed an informative light on situational awareness and training, but also I‘ll bet the 10mm will be the choice.

In personal defense situations at 21’, the probability of supressing an armed assailant (with a knife say) without injury is pretty remote if you’re not moving as well. I’m definitely not going for the pepper spray first…at all actually…we’d both end up disabled due to proximity of the blast, but I suspect I’m most likely going to wake up dead!

 

[Katadin4570]

I used to bow hunt in blackbear country and didn’t (at the time) carry a backup sidearm. I was always concerned about whether or not I could stop or deter a black bear with one arrow! It keeps you alert in the woods!

I bet, and I suspect puckered up as well…! Stay nimble!

 

[Katadin4570]

It was an interesting video. What I found a bit conflicting was bear spray @ 4 second full discharge at 20-30 ft and if it doesn't stop the attack, drawn (or have at-ready) the sidearm to continue the fight, which the author accomplished in training mode, 7 rounds in 6 seconds on target.

Let’s suppose 20 feet, 4 sec. blast of bear spray, followed up with 6 seconds of gun fire…and likely charging bear speed will cover probably that 20 ft. in - 1 second...and that’s if a bear is applying the Tueller Rule. Time is a luxury.

It’s going to take a good amount of practice… or narrow the choice of the two options?
I don’t know but I think if a bear is already in charge mode at 20-30 ft, it’s a darn good to convince me it isn’t just going to stop on the dime. I wouldn’t want to be in a predicament to guess wind direction and when seconds count, trying to fog it’s snout before it takes a swipe at me.

I don’t spend any time in the backwoods of any bear country but the kids do and have expressed interest in the .44 though never shot one. The only advice I could render is to find so with a .44, then try out (my) .38 spl, .38 +P, then a .357 magnum load for a feel. Then try getting 6 rounds on a 12” bullseye as fast as possible with each of the three loads. Finally while still fresh, try 6 with the .44 magnum.

I forwarded them the article, hopefully it will shed an informative light on situational awareness and training, but also I‘ll bet the 10mm will be the choice.

There's no guarantee that a griz or a black bear (they've killed people) won't have you for dinner if you're carrying a handgun.

I absolutely agree, but he will most certainly have you for dinner if you don’t…!

 

[Katadin4570]

I have luckily never had to defend myself from any bear attack. However, if I had to do so, it would not be spray. Just as humans that are exposed to O.C. spray and chemical agents, some are immune to the effects and can eat the chemical agents and maintain as it has no effect on them.

I would hate to use some "bear spray" and have the bear that has decided to attack me for his dinner be one of those immune to the spray and maul me to death. Especially when I could have been putting some well placed rounds on target the whole time instead of the spray.
My method would be a firearm without question.

In personal defense situations at 21’, the probability of supressing an armed assailant (with a knife say) without injury is pretty remote if you’re not moving as well. I’m definitely not going for the pepper spray first…at all actually…we’d both end up disabled due to proximity of the blast, but I suspect I’m most likely going to wake up dead!