RandomHero
Custom
How many of you have actually shot 500 rounds of your self defense ammunition through your pistol to ensure reliability?
Self defense ammunition.
- Thread starter RandomHero
- Start date
Tactical-Reviews
Master Class
I have about 100 rounds, but this stuff is super hot.
I never had an issue other than one, the case separated right in the middle of the case.
I never had an issue other than one, the case separated right in the middle of the case.
Ok, NOT ME! And that’s the truth, I purchased a couple of Kahr pistols I think they recommended a 500 round break in period before you bet your life on one. My opinion is 50 to 100 rounds of practice ammo and then 25 rounds of the actual carry ammo, clean the gun and reload. Maybe there is a kickback scheme with ammo manufacturers, but I know that is not true. My first LEO job I was on duty with a revolver that I didn’t shoot for three months. Another LEO job when we converted over to the Glock 17 we were just issued them and told to get to the range next week for weapon familiarization and to stay until you qualify. So we carried on duty for five to ten days with a brand new Glock that had only been test fired at the factory, maybe, they do that right? Are you really going to spend almost as much money on the carry ammo as you just invested in the gun? A pistol or revolver is a mechanical device, they can break and have manufacturing flaws, but if a 100 rounds does not prove it functions how far do you want to go? However, since I am a living breathing hipocrit (that’s why I go to church by the way) I would not carry a new 1911 until I had run 400 rounds through it.
Mr.W.
Professional
I've run 2 boxes of personal defense ammo through my carry pistol, mainly due to fresh ammo replacement every couple of years. While I firmly believe in a few hundred rounds to condition and break-in a new semiautomatic pistol, I don't believe it's necessary to use personal defense ammo. If your personal defense ammo feeds properly and consistently, rely on it! Good shooting.
I have shot 500+rnds with my carry guns but they all haven't been my carry round. With this many rounds I am confident in my carry weapons and ammo. Fact is you could have 3000 straight go bang, eject, and return to battery but 3001 don't do a thing. I leave the house everyday feeling as prepared and confident as humanly possible with the expectation that my equipment and I can perform if need be.
TEXASforLIFE
SAINT
My pd ammo is amix of fmj and hp alternating. I train with how they are stacked and none are factory. I velocity match each caliber. Many times I shoot out to 100 yards. No matter how I do my 9mm it takes a while too get there. A 90gr in a sig works well.
RandomHero
Custom
I posted this question because it is important to know that your weapon will reliably cycle your self defense ammunition. In my humble opinion the break in period for my guns is not done with practice ammunition. I want to break mine in with the ammunition I would use to protect my life with to ensure my weapon will reliably cycle if the need arises. And run it in different intervals and put it through it's paces. Yes, I know it's an investment, but I think a good one having that reassurance since all guns don't like all self defense ammunition.
TEXASforLIFE
SAINT
Too me it's if your carrying it practice with it.
I've shot a few boxes of Hornady American Gunner XTP 9mm+p 124 grain out of my carry pistols at 30ft-50ft ranges and have not seen a significant difference in accuracy using my carry ammo vs range ammo. With that being said I personally do not see a good reason I would need to run 500 rounds of carry ammo through my guns. I have run at least a couple thousand rounds of range ammo through these same guns so I am pretty proficient in getting the lead on target. I do test my carry ammo every few months and I will expend what I have and replace it with new so I have confidence of what I use is reliable.
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I've shot one mag of this ammo in 9mm and there is a very muted recoil from using such a light grain bullet. This ammo is a pretty cool concept. Did you use a glock 20? I've read the chamber tolerance in the Glock 10mm is a little loose which causes the cases to bulge when fired. I wonder if that could be part of the case separation issue you had if you used a Glock.
Tactical-Reviews
Master Class
I've not had the chance to test a 10mm glock, I've shot one, but that's it. After a few years of work, I finally made the Glock T&E team, so I'm looking forward to testing some out. Glock is a good every day gun, but that's about it. If you want anything more than that, you start replacing parts. As an exercise I built a Glock race gun. In the end, I replaced 100% of the parts, including the frame. Buy that point, $2500 into it, I could have bought a better gun. With that said, it's dead on accurate so long as I load the rounds.
RandomHero
Custom
Reason being for me and I reiterate me, is the radius of a hollow point can often be different than a full metal jacket. Therefore some ammunition like what I carry Federal HST has been found that some pistols won't reliably cycle it. So throwing full metal jacket round nose ammunition down range does not give me a definitive result on if it will do the same with a large hollow point. Again, it's just something I do. As long as you are confident in what you do to ensure your ammunition will perform in your pistol to save your life is all that matters. I know I'm one of very few that takes these steps, but I'd rather be sure then need it and have my pistol malfunction.
I can totally agree with your thinking!
I've had certain range ammo not cycle reliably in one of my carry pistols and testing is always a good idea!
^ I'm a HUGE believer in the absolute NEED to verify function of the defensive weapon, using my intended defensive ammo, using the very same magazines that gun is intended to receive in the defensive context.
Every. Single. One.
In the "function" context, the biggest worry is tolerance stacking. By checking function, I do my part to make sure that I take this gremlin out of the picture. Whether it is the unique gun somehow not "liking" that particular make/model of ammo or the bullet type or if the magazines interacts weirdly with it, these are problems that I simply cannot tolerate in te defensive context, as the bullet must exit the muzzle with deadly capabilities, in order for me to be successful in defending my life or that of my loved ones'.
The other main worry is then external ballistics. I have to know with-certainty how that shot will print downrange. I absolutely need to know what that bullet will do in relation to the POA/POI. Two inches on the vertical axis (or just one inch displacement) puts me outside the eyebox (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?4597-Targets&s=374c73be6a0a1f2f0453d345e4c3ee70). The heart is but a fist-sized organ. This marksmanship template only gets more demanding when the body is in-motion in 3-dimensional space, and we've seen time and again in recent events that while the 3-ft/3-shots/3-seconds rule may be "good enough," oftentimes, good enough is not good enough in the real world. [ I decided to expand on this a bit - https://www.thearmorylife.com/forum/threads/targets.346/#post-5124 ]
Really, the only way to do vet this is to put those cartridges in the gun and print rounds downrange.
Subjectively, I also want to remain familiar with the recoil characteristics of the defensive ammo, as well as how much muzzle blast (retention shooting or indoor shooting) and gunsmoke (low-light concerns) it will produce.
The good thing is that as many have noted in this thread - tolerance-stacking issues are usually seen sooner rather than later. Typically, issues will manifest right-off-the-bat, if not within only just a few rounds. Certainly, there can be extended-firing concerns, but in terms of the legal-citizen defensive-use context, what we're more concerned about here is more the gun being able to chew through its resident magazine/cylinder's worth of ammo and perhaps another two to three magazines' or speed-strips' worth, versus the zombie apocalypse's scenario of hundreds upon hundreds of rounds, non-stop.
Another real world truth is that, unfortunately, extended vetting gets expensive - fast.
My last defensive weapon purchased was the G32 that I keep as a car gun, and those 125 gr. .357-SIG Gold Dots are a half-dollar or so, each, at best.......
Don't even remind me of vetting my defensive AR with 77 gr. Black Hills......
One way to defray this cost is to simply vet the gun with one or two mags' worth, first, and then to continue that vetting on a routine cycle by expending loaded mags/cylinders during routine inspection and/or firing-out already-chambered ammo (bullet setback concerns) that have been segregated. This practice will not only amortize the cost of defensive ammo over the testing period, but will also help keep the shooter in-tune with the subjectives.
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Anything vetted by DocGKR is good-to-go:
Note that (1) DocGKR does not present that list in any order of preference/rank, that those cartridges/loads are simply what has proven themselves through the FBI's testing protocol and (2) that as with the OP of this thread, he urges readers of his FAQ to take the time to properly vet our choice by ourselves, in our own unique weapons.
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I break a gun in on FMJ range ammo but I also shoot at least 50 rounds of my carry ammo . I bought a Kel-tec PF9 once that shot anything I put in it without complaint. Then I decided I wanted to switch to Gold dots. Went to the range with my new carry ammo and tried it out. First mag full .... shot 3 rounds and nothing . Pulled the mag and the bullets were nose down in the mag . Smacked the mag and they popped back into place. reinserted the mag , fired 2 rounds and the same thing happened. It didn't matter which of the 5 mags I had with me were used , the same results every time.
I tried some more FMJs and no problems. Well I got the old carry ammo out and had no problems. It just wouldn't cycle the Gold dots for some reason. I always make sure my firearm will eat the carry ammo.
I tried some more FMJs and no problems. Well I got the old carry ammo out and had no problems. It just wouldn't cycle the Gold dots for some reason. I always make sure my firearm will eat the carry ammo.