Guy Mancuso
Elite
The Sentinal is also made of aluminum
Hellcat OSP Optic choices
- Thread starter Hellcatowner
- Start date
Guy Mancuso
Elite
LOL I totally understand. Im not sure where the Riton is made or who actually makes it. Swampfox is in Tucson which is actually 120 miles from me. I know how you feel I dealt with all this crap with the Sig P365 with out the slide cut and tore my hair out
Guy Mancuso
Elite
Probably the same company than
My 02. cents... This whole Hellcat experience has been eye-opening for me. Way back in this thread I revealed that I recently got back into firearms after a 10 year hiatus. First purchase after a Glock 19 Gen. 2 ten years ago was the Hellcat. Obviously I got the OSP and was very excited to get into RMRs and optics right away as I had never used one before (night sights on your handgun 10-12 years ago was considered a significant upgrade). I was initially taken aback from the price of said optics. I got my Hellcat OSP for something around $450 and I was flabbergasted at the thought of spending $300 for an accessory.
Since then, I've built my first AR-15 and spending less on a Holosun 510C holographic reflex sight than my Swampfox Sentinel gave me more insight into the micro red dot game, specifically talking $$$. I get that squeezing technology in a smaller package costs more for everyone, but still... I can't help but feel.. annoyed at having to spend more on a tiny red dot than a premium optic like the HS510C. The latest debate over that new Trijicon inspired me to make this post.
At the end of the day, the "it's your money" argument will always trump anyone else's opinions on value. For me personally? No way I'm spending over $200 on a tiny red dot for a tiny gun I don't expect to ever have to engage a threat over 10 yds. max. I've got a compact, full-size, and rifle to take care of anything further than that. And I'd rather spend my hard-earned cash on bigger, better, tougher optics for those bigger guns. Hellcat is my backup/last resort. Sure, if I was a millionaire I'd pour all kinds of cash into that thing (trigger upgrade, optic, etc.) But for an average guy making average money, I'm focusing my funds on making my primary weapons the best they can be. Backups are lowest priority.
Since then, I've built my first AR-15 and spending less on a Holosun 510C holographic reflex sight than my Swampfox Sentinel gave me more insight into the micro red dot game, specifically talking $$$. I get that squeezing technology in a smaller package costs more for everyone, but still... I can't help but feel.. annoyed at having to spend more on a tiny red dot than a premium optic like the HS510C. The latest debate over that new Trijicon inspired me to make this post.
At the end of the day, the "it's your money" argument will always trump anyone else's opinions on value. For me personally? No way I'm spending over $200 on a tiny red dot for a tiny gun I don't expect to ever have to engage a threat over 10 yds. max. I've got a compact, full-size, and rifle to take care of anything further than that. And I'd rather spend my hard-earned cash on bigger, better, tougher optics for those bigger guns. Hellcat is my backup/last resort. Sure, if I was a millionaire I'd pour all kinds of cash into that thing (trigger upgrade, optic, etc.) But for an average guy making average money, I'm focusing my funds on making my primary weapons the best they can be. Backups are lowest priority.
I share your annoyance. I got my SMSc through Springfield Armory today, and honestly it looks and feels like a 50-cent prize you'd get from a gum-ball machine. Once I installed the optic and roughed in the dot, I racked the slide using the optic. Wow, the dot is nowhere near the irons now. I looked at the optic and saw that the front part (window side) was raised up off the slide cut-out a wee bit. Removed, reinstalled, no gap. I adjusted the dot back to "just above a good iron sight picture" and racked the slide using the slide serrations instead of slinging it with the optic, and the dot again was off. To me it seems that with no "third mounting screw" near the front end of the optic, the polymer optic frame is free to move about at will.
Any suggestions?
Any suggestions?
I'm not familiar with the SMSc, how much does it go for? And BTW thanks for validating my comment. It is annoying isn't it? I jumped on the Micro red dot train prematurely I think due to excitement but I feel like it is still too new to expect any reasonable value/quality/reliability compared to proven, bigger optics like the 507C, 510C, EOTech etc. That new Trijicon for $500-$600 whatever really grinds my gears. YMMV, but no way am I dropping that on a tiny piece of tech that will, real-world, increase my SHTF/combat effectiveness by like 4% vs. $500 towards a 507C for my compact 9mm, and/or upgrades to my AR, trigger kit for my full-size handgun, etc... It's insane right now. When/if quality micro red dots settle down to the $200 range, I'll be much more interested. As of now? I'm taking my Swampfox Sentinel to my LGS for consignment. Again, not knocking on those who have the $$$, just my .02 from an average dude making average $$$.
Heck, I make somewhat better than "average money" and I'm still torqued when I run into things like this. I know the pics ain't great, but it's the best I can do right now and you should have an idea what I'm talking about.
I won't mind running the Hellcat naked, it takes the place of my original Shield that I ABSOLUTELY HATE the grip on. I'll consider this gun a step up with the increased capacity and better feel in my hand, but even a billionaire doesn't like throwing cash into the toilet. That's how they became billionaires. The SMSc is $300.
I won't mind running the Hellcat naked, it takes the place of my original Shield that I ABSOLUTELY HATE the grip on. I'll consider this gun a step up with the increased capacity and better feel in my hand, but even a billionaire doesn't like throwing cash into the toilet. That's how they became billionaires. The SMSc is $300.
Figured it out. The "washers" supplied from SA are some type of plastic, which crushed down too much when I tightened down the optic mounting screws. Because they're PLASTIC. I went to Lowe's and picked up a baggie of "Small Flat Washers metric M4x8" (83 cents for baggie of 12) and they work like a charm. Reapplied blue Loctite and mounted the optic using one washer for each screw, no more wandering red dot and no more gap at front of optic. SA,or Shield, whoever puts this "kit" together: please spend the extra $00.1383 for two steel washers. Then bump the price up by $5.
The quality of the Holosun sights is obvious as soon as you pick it up. Watching Sage Dynamics torture test should convince anyone in doubt. I have it mounted on my Hellcat and one on my Sig P365-XL. Currently it is on consignment with a local gun dealer for $950 which is less than I paid for the two. It has been over a week so I may remove the Holosun and sell the gun without the red dot as the 507K is selling on eBay for $400 and up. It is harder to find a buyer willing to spend $950 even though it is a. good deal.
The 507k looks great, and as you said it was torture tested by Sage Dynamics. It's currently the only micro red dot on the market that has been proven to be durable enough for conceal carrying. The Trijicon RMR cc probably is as well, haven't seen tests on it but they have their patented ears design that works on all their other RMRs so I suspect it works on the CC. Every other micro red dot on the market appears to be for range toys only and not for real world self defense use.
I would not pay $400 for a 507k. The only reason the 507k is out of stock right now is because Holosun had to slightly modify the design because Trijicon sued them. Holosun moved the buttons around as a result of the lawsuit which means they had to modify their manufacturing. They'll be back in stock soon enough, I can't see why anyone would be rushing to get one. You can live with your irons for another month or two until the new 507k-x2s are in stock. I believe the x2s will also come with a solar back up so they will likely be superior to the original 507k.
Feel free to correct me if anything I said was wrong, but that was what I understood from looking in to the 507k being out of stock.
Interesting... I've been debating on selling my Swampfox Sentinel and/or Hellcat and was wondering if I'd have to put them on consignment together, but I recently learned that my LGS will take the optic alone for consignment so I may do that. I didn't even consider the Ebay route though... Hellcat is such a good backup though... And I think I got it for a steal.
FYI the updated model of the Holosun 507k-x2 is back in stock. They're getting bought up like crazy but I was able to find one online still in stock on Rainier Arms website. Paired with this adapter plate:
chpws.com
You can get a lower witness (according to the seller, I called and asked) and still use the stock irons of the Hellcat. For me this is preferable to modifying the recoil lugs of the Hellcat's slide. If anyone is interested I'll post a pic when my optic & mounting plate come in.
Anyone have any ideas on what threadlocker, if any, I should pick up for this?
Springfield Hellcat w/ RMSc Footprint to Holosun 407k / 507k Adapter Plate - C&H Precision Weapons
The version 1 of these plates are discontinued, and a version 2 is currently in production. Version 2 plates are expected to ship Mid November. This is the optics adapter plate for the newly released Springfield Hellcat with RMSc Optic Cut. This plate is required to mount a Holosun 507k / 407k...
chpws.com
You can get a lower witness (according to the seller, I called and asked) and still use the stock irons of the Hellcat. For me this is preferable to modifying the recoil lugs of the Hellcat's slide. If anyone is interested I'll post a pic when my optic & mounting plate come in.
Anyone have any ideas on what threadlocker, if any, I should pick up for this?
jumpinjoe
Hellcat
Blue on the "Loktite". And make sure the screw threads and the holes are clean. A little alcohol on a stripped down Q-tip will do the trick. And make double sure whether the screws provided are Hex (Allen) set or whether they're a #5 Torx. They look a lot alike to us older folks with the tired eyes and I can't tell you how many of the Torx screw heads I've seen stripped out by folks mistaking them for Allen heads.
And "Hollosun" may have a specified 'torque' value to be applied to those screws. I'm pretty sure SA calls for about 9" pnds on the Hellcat.
Hope this is helpful. Maybe show us a pic after it's mounted and sighted through the window. I'd like to see just how well it co-witnesses with the Hellcat.
And "Hollosun" may have a specified 'torque' value to be applied to those screws. I'm pretty sure SA calls for about 9" pnds on the Hellcat.
Hope this is helpful. Maybe show us a pic after it's mounted and sighted through the window. I'd like to see just how well it co-witnesses with the Hellcat.
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It is a bummer to see the difficulty many have had with various red dot sights. There seems to be a noticeable quality range between them all. I have been using my Swampfox Sentinel for a few months and am really enjoying it. I did use blue Loktite and it is holding strong. The quality and durability of the sight has been clear to me. It fits well on the slide and the screws that came with it work perfectly. I bought mine from Swampfox and paid $238 with a 20% off coupon code. Could not be happier.
Guy Mancuso
Elite
yes me too. Very happy with my Sentinel