Is there a way for me to get the improved trigger for my pistol so that I may thank SA for fixing my gun, not just pistols bought by others in the future? As I said sometime back, if the new trigger can’t be locked up, I’ll be happy to pay for the upgrade.
Hellcat trigger debacle
- Thread starter SoNic
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Peglegjoe
Professional
You'd have to contact SA directly, which right now with their comm issues (hacked) is difficult. Add to that the fact that all available parts are being used for a) new production and b) warranty repairs, I don't know when they will be able to offer individual parts for retail sale. Best bet will be to contact them directly...once their comm systems are restored.
As I saw on two videos, it takes just some 10 passes with a fine file. It's soft plastic.
PS: The Apex, PRP and Hyve Tech triggers have the same sharp angled edge, so they might be "bad" too.
Wonder if they will change their designs too.
See them here:
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jumpinjoe
Hellcat
Just a little something riding heavy on my mind guys is that the Hellcat trigger was designed to almost 'require' a trigger finger to be placed squarely on the face of it in order for it to function correctly without hanging up. I'm pretty sure the intent in this was to prevent an 'Unintentional Discharge' due to a corner or a snap strap of a holster hanging on the trigger, or a jacket waist pull cord catching on the trigger, or maybe even an errant trigger finger while drawing the gun, etc, etc.
All I'm trying to say here guys is if you chose to file anything down (modify a designed safety feature) and something bad should happen, it ain't going to end well for you, and maybe for someone else as well. And hopefully if ever a 'UD' does happen, it won't involve another human being.
I dunno guys, maybe I'm just an old man who worries too damned much about too damned little ...... but I don't think I could live with it if I ever modified a safety device of a firearm and then accidentally shot and killed someone. Nor do I think I could ever answer to a family member of someone I killed when they asked me why I felt the need to modify that safety feature when I first decided I was willing to kill Mr. ????.
10 passes with a fine file is not much effort to cause something to go from very safe to not so very safe. And in my mind a very poor choice between rendering a safety device much less safe, and simply learning the technique to use it properly.
OK, I'm done harping. Pile on as you will ..... I've got a pretty thick skin. But before you do if you chose to, just re-read what I've written above. I've not pointed a finger at anyone, nor written anything derogatory about anyone. Just pointed out several examples of how things can so terribly sideways from such a simple appearing decision.
Friends & peace !!!
I absolutely agree. Everyone makes it's own informed decisions, I don't take responsibility for anyone's actions.
We are all adults and we should be able to think and evaluate what is more likely to happen...
UD because I am holstering negligently? UD when I drop the gun?
Or getting killed because, in a panic situation, I draw and pointed the gun, but could not fire when I pressed the trigger in a less than ideal way?
Personally I feel that I can control first two by training, but not the last. I can't train for panic situations.
But that's just me.
Luckily for me, SA updated the trigger on my model, no need to modify it's design. The first post was just to show differences, to inform.
I agree 100%. I’ll never modify the trigger. I won’t even replace it with an aftermarket one. But concern over being involved in a hand to hand tussle and not getting that perfect grip then hearing crickets when I expected to hear a bang concerns me. Sometime back I called SA about this and was told this was a purposeful design. THEN, they come out with an “improved” trigger. It would be nice to hear from SA that the “improvement “ has nothing to do with the trigger sticking issue and that the @improved” trigger ALSO sticks if any sidepull is applied before the safety blade is depressed. Either the new trigger sticks or it doesn’t. If it does, then my trigger is truly a designed safety feature. If the new trigger now DOESNT stick, then it starts to look like a quiet fix of an issue that SA doesn’t wish to acknowledge.Just a little something riding heavy on my mind guys is that the Hellcat trigger was designed to almost 'require' a trigger finger to be placed squarely on the face of it in order for it to function correctly without hanging up. I'm pretty sure the intent in this was to prevent an 'Unintentional Discharge' due to a corner or a snap strap of a holster hanging on the trigger, or a jacket waist pull cord catching on the trigger, or maybe even an errant trigger finger while drawing the gun, etc, etc.
All I'm trying to say here guys is if you chose to file anything down (modify a designed safety feature) and something bad should happen, it ain't going to end well for you, and maybe for someone else as well. And hopefully if ever a 'UD' does happen, it won't involve another human being.
I dunno guys, maybe I'm just an old man who worries too damned much about too damned little ...... but I don't think I could live with it if I ever modified a safety device of a firearm and then accidentally shot and killed someone. Nor do I think I could ever answer to a family member of someone I killed when they asked me why I felt the need to modify that safety feature when I first decided I was willing to kill Mr. ????.
10 passes with a fine file is not much effort to cause something to go from very safe to not so very safe. And in my mind a very poor choice between rendering a safety device much less safe, and simply learning the technique to use it properly.
OK, I'm done harping. Pile on as you will ..... I've got a pretty thick skin. But before you do if you chose to, just re-read what I've written above. I've not pointed a finger at anyone, nor written anything derogatory about anyone. Just pointed out several examples of how things can so terribly sideways from such a simple appearing decision.
Friends & peace !!!
It doesn't bind. Just takes a bit more effort than the normal pull.
uspatriot1960
Custom
I’ll comment again as this issue doesn’t seem to be dying. After playing more with my Hellcat, here’s the issue as I see it. Bottom line, it has nothing to do with lateral pressure on the trigger safety. It has to do with depressing the trigger before the blade is pressed. If you start pulling the trigger, then try to pull the blade, it won’t pull. You can push laterally as hard as you want on the blade, but if you haven’t moved the trigger, the blade will depress and the trigger can be pulled. But if you pull the trigger at all prior to depressing the blade, it won’t pull. IMO, this is by design. Suppose something pressed up against the trigger, pulling the trigger first, then rolling towards the blade? Would you want the gun to fire? I wouldn’t think so. It is designed for the blade to have to be depressed first, with the trigger following. It is not designed to start pulling the trigger first, then rolling onto the blade and still firing.
I don’t know if SA did this on purpose, by design. But it sure seems like a common sense safety feature to me. If the trigger can be pulled without the blade being depressed first, it doesn’t seem like much of a safety.
I’ll say this again as well. I’ve put hundreds of rounds through my Hellcat and dry fired numerous times as well and I cannot make this happen unless I’m trying to.
I don’t know if SA did this on purpose, by design. But it sure seems like a common sense safety feature to me. If the trigger can be pulled without the blade being depressed first, it doesn’t seem like much of a safety.
I’ll say this again as well. I’ve put hundreds of rounds through my Hellcat and dry fired numerous times as well and I cannot make this happen unless I’m trying to.
uspatriot1960
Custom
Glock was the first to come out with this. Here’s what they have to say about it:
“The trigger safety is designed to prevent the pistol from firing if it’s dropped or if the trigger is subjected to any pressure that isn’t a direct firing pull.”
Safe Action System
GLOCK’s revolutionary SAFE ACTION® System provides a consistent trigger pull from the first to the last round. The three automatic independently-operating mechanical safeties are built into the fire control system of the pistol.
us.glock.com
I think it was an issue for some but not all.
The reason I think it was an issue is because the 2nd gen trigger DOES NOT DO THIS and upon closer inspection the part of the trigger blade safety the would hang doesn't look the same.
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uspatriot1960
Custom
Well, I bought mine in July of last year, so I don’t think I have the 2nd gen trigger...
Not everyone complains about it. Some didn't even know until videos started to show up on YouTube. I knew about it when customers were bringing them back asking us to look at them. I can make it do it but I have never allowed it to bother me but it also isn't the only gun I carry. I can understand their fears but I also told them we can't fix it and they'd need to ask a gunsmith to do it or install an aftermarket trigger.
SaltyMonkey
Professional
Agreed. This further illustrates that Springfield has their finger on the pulse and actively listens to their consumers.
That's probably the easiest way to solve this. Metal will not bind as easy under pressure (doesn't deform) and especially now that the aftermarket copied the new angle, it's even better.
Too bad that SA doesn't sell spare parts.
It also looks to me that Gen 1 trigger had serrations on the face of the trigger, see the first picture. Gen 2 triggers the serrations were removed, the face of the trigger is now smooth. The second picture is an illustration of the serrations on a Glock trigger for better visualization.Two entirely different triggers. Look at the difference in (what I assume is) the return spring retainer. Don't know when SA might have redesigned the trigger to this effect, but mine (Hellcat) is just over a year old and has the trigger in the top picture. Yours, apparently a newer version, must be the redesign to address the 'lock-up' issue. ???
Maybe someone in the know can chime in and set us straight.
Attachments
In my case, I had not seen the videos until I started researching the issue. The very first time out of the box when I shot my new Hellcat it “stuck” on me several times. I was perplexed and curious as to just what was going on. That’s how I found the videos online, as I tried to get answers.
SkyMarshall
Alpha
I have the Gen 1 Hellcat. Never knew there was a trigger issue until I read about it online. Yup. If I miss-handle the trigger by not pulling it straight back, I can make it lock up tight. FYI, my S&W M&P has a high dollar aftermarket Apex trigger that works flawlessly for me and is worth the money to upgrade. Low and behold, if I mis-handle it I can make it lock up too. I had no idea until I started reading these posts. They never lock up on me when I want either gun to discharge. Not ever in thousands of rounds.
If in you hands, the Gen 1 trigger locks up when firing, file a warranty claim and get the new trigger installed. Or buy a Gen 2 gun then sell your Gen 1 gun at panic market prices once the new one is in your holster. Or buy a Sig. Either way, only carry a gun you trust. I happen to trust mine with my life, but your mileage may vary. ;-).
If in you hands, the Gen 1 trigger locks up when firing, file a warranty claim and get the new trigger installed. Or buy a Gen 2 gun then sell your Gen 1 gun at panic market prices once the new one is in your holster. Or buy a Sig. Either way, only carry a gun you trust. I happen to trust mine with my life, but your mileage may vary. ;-).
Bassbob
Emissary
I don't have a Hellcat but here's what I found after trying several pistols. None of my Shields ( stock triggers) failed to engage no matter what I did to them. My VP9 will not fire if you pull sideaways without engaging the blade safety. However, if you pull the trigger without touching the blade safety first and then wiggle your finger over to the blade, it will engage. The Walther Q5 will not engage if the blade is not depressed before you pull the trigger and pulling sideways without engaging the blade will cause it not to engage. The Mod 2 .45 reacted the same way as the VP9 and there was virtually no way to pull sideways without engaging the blade safety. I had to try several times to get it to not engage.
Having never handled a Hellcat I can't say if it is different than any of the pistols I just tried. For the record, the Walther Q is the only one I never carry.
Having never handled a Hellcat I can't say if it is different than any of the pistols I just tried. For the record, the Walther Q is the only one I never carry.
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