ACIinventor
Elite
I see your use of the word "Ranger." Surely, if you've completed all phases of that training, you would understand the importance of training. Banging your head against the wall of truth is one way to wake up.
Should training be mandatory? Answer: No!
- Thread starter Ranger715
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ACIinventor
Elite
What do Liberals have to cover-up? Some Republican conspiracy theory that has been thoroughly debunked over and over again? I agree, either side can participate in nefarious activities but right now, nobody can hold a candle to the near biblical level of Republican horseshit. As for the stats, they are easy to hide when there is no concerted effort to collect the data. Just because some don't want to collect the data, doesn't mean its not there.Certainly - either side can (and both certainly have) "juke(d) the stats." Mark Twain (special place in my heart for more than one reason, not the least of which was that he made good fun of my Alma Mater) very eloquently put that into words, in Chapters from My Autobiography.
But if we are to take this somewhat conspiracist view, couldn't we also say that "liberal mainstream media" would certainly tear into such attempts at cover-up?
ACIinventor
Elite
Gotta be a troll.
Am I? Or am I so sane that you just blew your mind?
Or has some sort of brain damage.
Is it? Or is it so possible that your head is spinning like a top?
...there would be evidence of it by now.
Can't it? Or is your entire world crashing down all around you?
And this is where you show your cards.
There are plenty of conspiracy theories circulating on the left. One of the most prominent was the liberal, granola-holistic anti-vax theories of years past (think Jenny McCarthy). From The Washington Post, and article dating back to 2014 - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...piracy-theories-arent-just-for-conservatives/ That movement, itself, dates back to the early/mid-oughts.
Crazy exists all along the spectrum, and is not exclusive to either extreme - nor is it absent as one nears the center.
Believe it or not, I was actually a registered Democrat until just this past election (now Libertarian - I decided that I didn't want to belong to a party whose rallying-cry was "Believe the Science," when their own actions here in my state, at the start of the pandemic, went against that very science which they professed to so revere...).
My cousin -whom I am very close with- is politically much further on the left than I ever was, and we constantly surprise each other with the craziest stuff that we didn't know existed, "on the other side." I do not see how this can then be declared a win for either side of the argument. If neither side collects the data, how can one blame the other for omission?
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And this is where you show your cards.
There are plenty of conspiracy theories circulating on the left. One of the most prominent was the liberal, granola-holistic anti-vax theories of years past (think Jenny McCarthy). From The Washington Post, and article dating back to 2014 - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...piracy-theories-arent-just-for-conservatives/ That movement, itself, dates back to the early/mid-oughts.
Crazy exists all along the spectrum, and is not exclusive to either extreme - nor is it absent as one nears the center.
Believe it or not, I was actually a registered Democrat until just this past election (now Libertarian - I decided that I didn't want to belong to a party whose rallying-cry was "Believe the Science," when their own actions here in my state, at the start of the pandemic, went against that very science which they professed to so revere...).
I do not see how this can then be declared a win for either side of the argument. If neither side collects the data, how can one blame the other for omission?
Agreed.
Like the "Believe the Science" bunk some choose to completely believe in too? Remember, science also got us into some real whoppers from time to time and likely this time too? Real common sense can be derailed by narrow minded extremism on either or any side sometimes. - A nose, busy to a grindstone, can lead to issues too if not coming up for air from time to time as well.
^ As a scientist, all that I can say is that science cannot be a religion: which, sadly, is what some are pressing it to be.
And as my mentor is fond of saying, all that science can ever do is prove itself wrong. And yes, he's the forgetful-professor type, whose own background makes him somewhat unique in our field. The hippy-liberal son of a conservative, steel-working/scrapping family who himself has worked the mills of his forefathers, he's always had one foot firmly planted in hard science (molecular biology) behind ivy-tower walls, while the other is planted the realities of the world as an avid outdoorsman, traveler, and in having been a high-school science teacher (which his daughter has taken up as of the last 2 years in an award-winning manner).
As you wisely noted, @BobM , science cannot (and should not) replace common-sense. Abiding by our current understanding of "the science" requires our understanding that science is ever-changing and ever-expanding. This in-turn demands our humility in accepting that we only know what we know today, and that tomorrow, things may change. Instead of looking at science as fixed dogma, we must realize that its interpretation needs to be much more nuanced - we must recognize that our own biases can come into play very quickly to corrupt this, even as we would wave its flag to use it to champion whatever line of thought we each may want to argue.
Common-sense in that we have seen the science of anything change over time, and the humility in knowing that even the most astute scientists are still human and themselves fallible...these truths must never be forgotten.
And as my mentor is fond of saying, all that science can ever do is prove itself wrong. And yes, he's the forgetful-professor type, whose own background makes him somewhat unique in our field. The hippy-liberal son of a conservative, steel-working/scrapping family who himself has worked the mills of his forefathers, he's always had one foot firmly planted in hard science (molecular biology) behind ivy-tower walls, while the other is planted the realities of the world as an avid outdoorsman, traveler, and in having been a high-school science teacher (which his daughter has taken up as of the last 2 years in an award-winning manner).
As you wisely noted, @BobM , science cannot (and should not) replace common-sense. Abiding by our current understanding of "the science" requires our understanding that science is ever-changing and ever-expanding. This in-turn demands our humility in accepting that we only know what we know today, and that tomorrow, things may change. Instead of looking at science as fixed dogma, we must realize that its interpretation needs to be much more nuanced - we must recognize that our own biases can come into play very quickly to corrupt this, even as we would wave its flag to use it to champion whatever line of thought we each may want to argue.
Common-sense in that we have seen the science of anything change over time, and the humility in knowing that even the most astute scientists are still human and themselves fallible...these truths must never be forgotten.
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tapehoser
Master Class
Sorry, I see mandatory training as infringement. No two ways about it for me, but I'm happy to listen to opposing opinions and don't fault anyone for thinking differently. My ideas behind my own personal agency (freedom to choose) are derived from my own understanding of Christian principles and the inspired leaders who founded this Nation.