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Should You Choose a Pump-Action or Semi-Automatic Shotgun for Home Defense?

jumpinjoe said:
While I can't/won't argue any of the several replies above, I still didn't see the actual answer I think was being explored: Why is it that shotguns specifically are not typically carried/packed in a loaded status with the safety ON?

All the conditions mentioned make sense, but we all carry our pistols full loaded, usually one in the pipe and safety on. Why only the shotgun is packed 'cruiser ready/safe'?
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Because when we talk about “cruiser ready”, the shotgun is not being carried on-person, but is in a stored state in the vehicle.
 
jumpinjoe said:
While I can't/won't argue any of the several replies above, I still didn't see the actual answer I think was being explored: Why is it that shotguns specifically are not typically carried/packed in a loaded status with the safety ON?

All the conditions mentioned make sense, but we all carry our pistols full loaded, usually one in the pipe and safety on. Why only the shotgun is packed 'cruiser ready/safe'?
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I explained it over the course of a few posts. When you are talking about LEO I think it's because they are often tasked with carrying a shotgun into a potentially dangerous situation and at the same time they are held accountable any time they discharge that weapon. Therefore cruiser status forces them to purposefully load the chamber before they discharge. Keeping your shotgun in cruiser status as a civilian, in your home as a SD weapon makes sense if you anticipate similar circumstances.. That is if you think it is possible to encounter "Friendlies" inside your home. It also makes sense if you are concerned with the fact that your shotgun ( really any shotgun) is not "Drop Safe". Your handgun most likely is drop safe.

Hans just explained the nomenclature.
 
Bassbob said:
I explained it over the course of a few posts. When you are talking about LEO I think it's because they are often tasked with carrying a shotgun into a potentially dangerous situation and at the same time they are held accountable any time they discharge that weapon. Therefore cruiser status forces them to purposefully load the chamber before they discharge. Keeping your shotgun in cruiser status as a civilian, in your home as a SD weapon makes sense if you anticipate similar circumstances.. That is if you think it is possible to encounter "Friendlies" inside your home. It also makes sense if you are concerned with the fact that your shotgun ( really any shotgun) is not "Drop Safe". Your handgun most likely is drop safe.

Hans just explained the nomenclature.
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Understand from this perspective, but I think the term 'drop safe' is where the confusion (at least my confusion) comes in. Why or how is a shotgun not considered 'drop safe' when other guns are?
 
jumpinjoe said:
Understand from this perspective, but I think the term 'drop safe' is where the confusion (at least my confusion) comes in. Why or how is a shotgun not considered 'drop safe' when other guns are?
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With a few exceptions only striker fired guns are drop safe. Because they are usually engineered that way. Same reason they are usually engineered with much crappier triggers than your 1911.
 
jumpinjoe said:
OK, makes sense. When AR's or similar rifles are stored in vehicles, are they too stored in a 'cruiser safe/ready' condition?
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Absolutely. Having investigated or learned of a number of negligent discharges over the years, you never underestimate the ability of even the most experienced people to overcome your safety procedures and equipment. I also recall a comment by my instructor in my first formal shotgun training 53 years ago. "The safety on this gun is mechanical. Like all things mechanical, it can fail".
 
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HayesGreener said:
Absolutely. Having investigated or learned of a number of negligent discharges over the years, you never underestimate the ability of even the most experienced people to overcome your safety procedures and equipment. I also recall a comment by my instructor in my first formal shotgun training 53 years ago. "The safety on this gun is mechanical. Like all things mechanical, it can fail".
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OK, then my thinking it only related to shotguns was incorrect, right? Don't know where I got the idea it only applied to the shotguns, but some reason I did and that's what didn't make sense to me. I can't agree any more that we're talking about 'mechanical' safeties which can/some will fail at some point.
 
jumpinjoe said:
Understand from this perspective, but I think the term 'drop safe' is where the confusion (at least my confusion) comes in. Why or how is a shotgun not considered 'drop safe' when other guns are?
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I am not a gun expert, Jumpinjoe, but I think you are correct in that shotguns and probably most rifles are not "drop safe." Modern handguns are because of the way they are designed. The firing pin cannot contact the cartridge unless the trigger is pulled. This goes for both revolvers and semi-autos, if they are "modern." So, you can drop them and they don't go off unless somehow the trigger gets pulled and the grip safety is depressed, etc. -- not likely. Unless things have changed, most hunting rifles and shotguns have a safety that keeps you from pulling the trigger when it is on, but if you jar the rifle or shotgun hard enough you can cause the hammer to slip off the sear and the gun will go off. I have had this happen to me when I was young and stupid.
 
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somorris said:
I am not a gun expert, Jumpinjoe, but I think you are correct in that shotguns and probably most rifles are not "drop safe." Modern handguns are because of the way they are designed. The firing pin cannot contact the cartridge unless the trigger is pulled. This goes for both revolvers and semi-autos, if they are "modern." So, you can drop them and they don't go off unless somehow the trigger gets pulled and the grip safety is depressed, etc. -- not likely. Unless things have changed, most hunting rifles and shotguns have a safety that keeps you from pulling the trigger when it is on, but if you jar the rifle or shotgun hard enough you can cause the hammer to slip off the sear and the gun will go off. I have had this happen to me when I was young and stupid.
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Agreed on most guns being NOT DROP SAFE!
 
Keystone19250 said:
In NO WAY am I saying Mossberg made junk, I was in a way being funny about being involved making so many that I wouldn’t want to own one.
Full disclosure I’ve never shot a shotgun.
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Bassbob said:
Agreed. I too keep a 500 close by. Mainly because it's what my wife knows and I have it set up perfectly. 8 in it and 12 on it. That's not to say there aren't others, autos, close by as well though.
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I gots double barrel
Bassbob said:
I have a couple old bolt action 16s.
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How about the Winchester 1901? I wish!!!
 
Recusant said:
Did you ever think the President would agree with you?

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HayesGreener said:
I have used shotguns for hunting and competition more than 60 years, used them often in my LE career, and have taught hundreds of officers in defensive use of the shotgun. When people ask my advice on a home defense firearm, I will most often recommend a pump shotgun, unless they are a proficient pistol or rifle shot.

I have been present twice when a suspect was shot center mass at close range with 00 and that ended the aggression. At the ranges present in most residential rooms, the shotgun is a devastating fight stopper. There is a definite psychological effect on miscreants when the shotgun is deployed.

Most of my experience has been with Remington 870's or Ithaca 37's since that is mostly what most LE agencies have used over the past 70 years. LE training doctrine calls for the shotgun to be carried with the tube loaded and an empty chamber, with the safety "on", in what is called the "cruiser safe" condition, to minimize the potential for negligent discharges. The gun is charged when responding to a perceived threat.

A lot of my students over the years thought they knew how to operate a shotgun until we put them under pressure to load, reload, and operate the gun in a combat course of fire and they all of a sudden became all thumbs and forgot there the controls are. You have to practice with these guns.

Users must practice releasing the slide lock and the safety in order to chamber a round and fire. Semi autos that are not maintained properly are prone to malfunction more so than pump guns but any can fail. Any shotgun requires training and practice in manipulation of the controls and action as they are not intuitive. Recoil is a problem for some shooters but the effects of recoil can be minimized with proper technique. I am comfortable with them. If I knew I was going into CQB, my first choice is my 870 with #4 buck.
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Absolutely Agreed on #4 buck! A lot of people think 000 or 00 is the way to go! Not nessasarly the case. That huge shot can over penetrate walls. Witch we all know isn't good with kids or other family and friends in different rooms of the house if s*** goes down! Not saying #4 won't penetrate walls, but more less likely to than bigger buck, and #4 will do a devistating number at ten yards and closer! All just my opinion! Shoot fun, shoot safe and shoot straight!
 
Kodiak Cowboy said:
Absolutely Agreed on #4 buck! A lot of people think 000 or 00 is the way to go! Not nessasarly the case. That huge shot can over penetrate walls. Witch we all know isn't good with kids or other family and friends in different rooms of the house if s*** goes down! Not saying #4 won't penetrate walls, but more less likely to than bigger buck, and #4 will do a devistating number at ten yards and closer! All just my opinion! Shoot fun, shoot safe and shoot straight!
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Oh it will penetrate walls. And there’s twice as many projectiles and a significantly wider pattern. Which may be preferable in some circumstances.
 
Probably opens up more than bigger buck shot at a further distance because of number of pellets I'm guessing, but I'm no shot gun expert by any means.
 
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