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Thoughts on Assange ?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bassbob
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Bassbob said:
I’m conflicted. In reality I have no objection to bringing the illegal and unconstitutional actions of the CIA, FBI and other government agencies to light.

On the other hand I have a problem with a US soldier handing top secret government information out to hackers. Chuck Manning was a US soldier and citizen. Assange is neither. And frankly outside of murder or certain other serious crimes I’m not in favor of the US ( or any country) cajoling other countries into turning over non citizens for prosecution.

In a general way I support Wikileaks and anyone striving to hold governments accountable for their shady BS. OpSec stuff, troop deployments or foreign policy strategies on the other hand not so much.

What say you ?
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Cedric said:
Assange was more than a hacker. He was a go between for Manning and Snowden. Specifically Manning was communicating with Assange to figure out how to download the files and then send them to Assange. IMO, Assange was an electronic handler for certainly Manning, and a conduit for Snowden. Manning and Teixeira being military the wheels of justice turned pretty quickly. Snowden and Assange likely have a lot of leverage against the powers that be so I think their future is will continue to be not sitting in a prison somewhere. I do wish Snowden all the worst though and hope he and Lindsey have a grand old time in Putin's Russia.
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Bassbob said:
I’m conflicted. In reality I have no objection to bringing the illegal and unconstitutional actions of the CIA, FBI and other government agencies to light.

On the other hand I have a problem with a US soldier handing top secret government information out to hackers. Chuck Manning was a US soldier and citizen. Assange is neither. And frankly outside of murder or certain other serious crimes I’m not in favor of the US ( or any country) cajoling other countries into turning over non citizens for prosecution.

In a general way I support Wikileaks and anyone striving to hold governments accountable for their shady BS. OpSec stuff, troop deployments or foreign policy strategies on the other hand not so much.

What say you ?
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Assange was incarcerated for 12 years with no charges brought.
 
Old_Me said:
why would the government "spy" on Americans for no apparent reason?

to me, that tells me, the government "suspects" wrong doing by the individual or group they are "spying" on.

information must have been gathered by informants, video, audio, witnesses, of the possible wrong doing(s)

if nothing materializes, then cut off the "spying" and move on to the next possible threat.

this *** clown, came to mind, as i was typing this

en.wikipedia.org

Timothy McVeigh - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

i believe that LEO should have kept a closer eye..."spy" on him, maybe that would have prevented babies being killed....

then again, maybe not......who knows.
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So you trust the government with the virtually unlimited power of surveillance of US citizens ? Support The Patriot Act and all that too ? Then you certainly shouldn't have a problem with the credit card companies flagging gun purchases for the government ? Those firearm specific CC codes shouldn't worry you any. I'm surprised you bellyache about the government overreach in your state gun laws as much as you do.
 
Cedric said:
Assange was more than a hacker. He was a go between for Manning and Snowden. Specifically Manning was communicating with Assange to figure out how to download the files and then send them to Assange. IMO, Assange was an electronic handler for certainly Manning, and a conduit for Snowden. Manning and Teixeira being military the wheels of justice turned pretty quickly. Snowden and Assange likely have a lot of leverage against the powers that be so I think their future is will continue to be not sitting in a prison somewhere. I do wish Snowden all the worst though and hope he and Lindsey have a grand old time in Putin's Russia.
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He was a hacker who never stole or infected networks with viruses or hacked for personal gain. Whether we agree with what he did or not, he at least believed he was doing the right thing. And there is no doubt that a lot of what Wikileaks uncovered and made public NEEDED to be made public. I think the people screaming the loudest about him being a spy and a criminal are the exact same people who were subverting the law for their own purposes and got caught.
 
Bassbob said:
So you trust the government with the virtually unlimited power of surveillance of US citizens ? Support The Patriot Act and all that too ? Then you certainly shouldn't have a problem with the credit card companies flagging gun purchases for the government ? Those firearm specific CC codes shouldn't worry you any. I'm surprised you bellyache about the government overreach in your state gun laws as much as you do.
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"They" have been violating executive orders (the base order signed by Reagan btw), DoD regulations, gov't regs, and laws. There have been well established procedures for intel agencies who are not allowed to collect on US persons or entities to turn over info to the FBI if a US person is involved with a foreign actor. All have ignored all of this, or made hay out of illegal collection. Like I said before, no leadership or a corrupted leadership allows and encourages this. Like the FBI, we keep waiting for the good people to come forward. If they have, I haven't heard about it.
 
Any non-US citizen or visitor that commits and/or aids and abets a felonious act by anyone else should be banned from entering the US no matter what the political issue is.

Assange fled the country to avoid arrest & trial so those acts constitute guilt, regardless of a formal trial, therefore forfeited any future entry into the country.

If he wants to play house with PSA now both can move/back to Canada.

My .02
 
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Bassbob said:
I’m conflicted. In reality I have no objection to bringing the illegal and unconstitutional actions of the CIA, FBI and other government agencies to light.

On the other hand I have a problem with a US soldier handing top secret government information out to hackers. Chuck Manning was a US soldier and citizen. Assange is neither. And frankly outside of murder or certain other serious crimes I’m not in favor of the US ( or any country) cajoling other countries into turning over non citizens for prosecution.

In a general way I support Wikileaks and anyone striving to hold governments accountable for their shady BS. OpSec stuff, troop deployments or foreign policy strategies on the other hand not so much.

What say you ?
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Got nothing to say, YOU summed it up nicely.
1719488208780.png
 
Cedric said:
They are filling an ever expanding workload based on "nice to have" requirements by the military and civilian leadership. It is a bloated and rudderless community which is designed to enrich gov't and corporate coffers, and has little to do with national security priorities.
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then reduce the load.
 
Bassbob said:
So you trust the government with the virtually unlimited power of surveillance of US citizens ? Support The Patriot Act and all that too ? Then you certainly shouldn't have a problem with the credit card companies flagging gun purchases for the government ? Those firearm specific CC codes shouldn't worry you any. I'm surprised you bellyache about the government overreach in your state gun laws as much as you do.
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i don't buy guns or ammo with a credit card.

do you think we are not being monitored or watched as it is now?

if the government thru informants or other means of intelligence (yeah i know an oxymoron), and it is found a person, or group of people are in any way connected to some sort of over-throw of the government, or other acts of terrorism, then "spying" on them should be done.

i'd rather the gov'ment be pro-active, than re-active...
 
Pitdogg2 said:
Personally I have a problem with any outside "contractors" having ANY access to any and all top secret or sensitive information at all.
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as a retired navy, then a CONTRACTOR...omg its a shady situation that the DOD has tasks that need to be filled because of some bloated system...i was happy to take the money...it allowed me to retire retire at a younger age
but my office didnt steal secrets
or skiff room was a scary concrete cold place at the bottom of the building with only one way in and out and absolutely no one in there by themselves EVER and never ever with usb, cell phone, laptop..nope. everything had to be signed out with 2 signatures and those 2 had to deliver the items to the government handlers...

never mind DHS had a room next door to us.... they were scary loose with procedures
 
Manning, Snowden, Teixeria are traitors, plain and simple. Assange was a facilitator, in CI parlance a handling agent. Human intelligence, and sources and methods information is the highest level of classification. These were some of the most carefully guarded secrets in the intelligence community and the harm to the intel community is irrepairable. Why such low level idiots like Snowden, Manning, and Teixeria had access and the ability to share it is a stunning failure of security. Just for clarity, NSA was not doing warrantless eavesdropping on US person phone calls-they were preserving the metadata, or simply who was calling who. I don't condone it, but accuracy is important.
 
powerboatr said:
as a retired navy, then a CONTRACTOR...omg its a shady situation that the DOD has tasks that need to be filled because of some bloated system...i was happy to take the money...it allowed me to retire retire at a younger age
but my office didnt steal secrets
or skiff room was a scary concrete cold place at the bottom of the building with only one way in and out and absolutely no one in there by themselves EVER and never ever with usb, cell phone, laptop..nope. everything had to be signed out with 2 signatures and those 2 had to deliver the items to the government handlers...

never mind DHS had a room next door to us.... they were scary loose with procedures
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I'm not bashing all contractors; I was one. We've had contractors since the revolutionary war. In principle, they satisfy a need with expertise that is in short supply. However, there are a couple of problems. 1) Too many in the national security/military realm don't really know their job, so a knee jerk reaction is to call in contractors. 2) Contractor corporations have evolved to writing requirements for the military for goods and services and then, of course, step forward as the sole source to satisfy the requirements they have written. It's literally killing us.
 
HayesGreener said:
Manning, Snowden, Teixeria are traitors, plain and simple. Assange was a facilitator, in CI parlance a handling agent. Human intelligence, and sources and methods information is the highest level of classification. These were some of the most carefully guarded secrets in the intelligence community and the harm to the intel community is irrepairable. Why such low level idiots like Snowden, Manning, and Teixeria had access and the ability to share it is a stunning failure of security. Just for clarity, NSA was not doing warrantless eavesdropping on US person phone calls-they were preserving the metadata, or simply who was calling who. I don't condone it, but accuracy is important.
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You summed it up nicely. The minute I saw the docs posted by Teixera marked with humint sources I thought someone in the field will pay dearly for this act of espionage. BTW, it amazes me that our press refers to these people as "leakers" instead of the traitors they are.
 
Bassbob said:
Yep. Which is BS.
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And this is why I buy all my ammo on a credit card and don't give flying f___ about it. They already know...

I do NOT carry a credit card by any of the national banks, however. I use my local po-dunk credit union. But I know enough to know that my card is probably under-written (term? who knows/cares) by a national bank.

Sorry to contribute to the tangent.
 
Jfal said:
And this is why I buy all my ammo on a credit card and don't give flying f___ about it. They already know...

I do NOT carry a credit card by any of the national banks, however. I use my local po-dunk credit union. But I know enough to know that my card is probably under-written (term? who knows/cares) by a national bank.

Sorry to contribute to the tangent.
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Yeah, I'm not scared either. I don't recall the last gun I bought not on a credit card. Even in person at the LGS.

F 'em.
 
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